A Different Melody for the Sub tuum præsidium
  • Josh
    Posts: 103
    Spurred on by a detailed account on the New Liturgical Movement about the Sub tuum præsidium, I've been comparing the different versions of the chant for that Marian anthem, most of which are clearly variants of each other - Roman, Monastic, Dominican, Cistercian, Premonstratensian, the cantus firmus used by Obrecht in his eponymous Mass (disregarding the length of the notes) - but one, which is used as part of the Kneeling Prayers of Jasna Góra, and proper to that shrine's guardians, the Order of St Paul the First Hermit, is utterly different, and I can't work out its mode, as it ends on do. There is a recording of it available online also. Does anyone know its history or care to comment?

    If anyone happens to have the Carthusian chant for this anthem, please post. Ditto for the Carmelite - frustratingly, I have a book containing it, but that book is somewhere inside a large pile of dozens of boxes not yet unpacked after moving house, since the new bookshelves haven't been delivered yet. (And just in case anyone has the Coptic text, which I have hunted for without success, do let me know.) Many thanks in advance!
    Roman Sub tuum præsidium.pdf
    23K
    Monastic Sub tuum præsidium.pdf
    23K
    Dominican Sub tuum præsidium.pdf
    22K
    Cistercian Sub tuum præsidium.pdf
    24K
    Premonstratensian Sub tuum præsidium.pdf
    20K
    Obrecht Sub tuum præsidium.pdf
    24K
    OSPPE Sub tuum præsidium.pdf
    19K
    Thanked by 2Paul F. Ford tomjaw
  • Josh
    Posts: 103
    Many thanks for these links!

    I have now searched the Cantus database myself, and found yet another more elaborate melody in mode I for an earlier form of the Sub tuum, which I append as I have transcribed it. It is evidently closer to the Greek original, translating τὴν σὴν εὐσπλαγχνίαν as tuis visceribus, and omitting the words sancta, cunctis and gloriosa et, which are not present in the Greek. Were it not for these textual variants, one could term it a "solemn" rather than a "simple" tone for this Marian anthem.
    Einsiedeln Sub tuis visceribus.pdf
    21K
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • tomjaw
    Posts: 2,782
    More versions here,
    The version below is from "Le Petit office de la tres sainte Vierge"imageimage

    I produced the file below some time ago to show the differences between books,
    Subtuum.pdf
    78K
    SubTuum1.jpg
    422 x 64 - 13K
    SubTuum2.jpg
    418 x 225 - 38K
  • Josh
    Posts: 103
    It makes you realise how each and every chant must have had so many variants throughout Europe before the chant was standardised, and how much work the monks of Solesmes had to do to collate so many manuscripts and somehow determine which version to adopt and adapt. Now I wonder what the Sarum version was like...
  • tomjaw
    Posts: 2,782
    Josh
    I have the Sarum books, but have not managed to find where to look...

    Did you see the Mode I version in the above file?
  • Josh
    Posts: 103
    I missed it at first glance - interesting!

    Any idea about the mode of the OSPPE version of this chant?