Well see you can't play that at mass because we don't have any reeds on the organ

A Catholic nerd. Makes comic-book store nerds look suave.

From your description, he does not sound like a candidate for the priesthood any more than he sounds like a candidate for your hand.

Hmmm...maybe a good tactic. If you feel he's boxing you in, bring up his possible calling to the priesthood.

I will just note that a young man who actually says "Oh well, you are but a woman" to a woman needs far more than exercises in humility.)

Bingo, Liam! Big red flag there that something's amiss.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbFq3CyXqWc

Hmmm. Is it possible he was saying "you are but a woman" in a joking fashion? Although a horrid stupid attempt at a joke? I honestly can't imagine a man in his mid-20s A.D. 2016 saying that in earnest.
Is it possible he's had a crush on you even during that obnoxious time, and that was his hopelessly awkward way of trying to interact with you? Not trying to make excuses for the guy - - just trying to parse out the timing of his crush (or whatever it is).
Anyway, as he gets older and more mature- - he may get more tolerable (to deal with, not date). A lady who was a substitute grandmother of mine, once told me that one should never marry a man under 30, because they're not ready to settle down yet (I realize I maybe just offended half the men on this board). If he asks you out, tell him he's not old enough to go courting. : ) Or, you could say "I don't date parishioners". Or, "I only date millionaire playboys / punk rockers / film directors / vegans...etc".

Julie

Thanks. There's a terrible school of old Catholic piety that should not be permitted to take root in new traditionalist communities: it's an erstwhile piety that saw social awkwardnesses of divers sorts as a sign of potential vocation to clerical or religious life. It's really a form of utilitarianism disguised as a form of mytisical piety* - it's designed (mostly subconsciously) to border-collie socially awkward folk into some sort of non-marital sheepfold, but the problem is that priests and non-eremetic religious have to have MORE intense social skills than regular layfolk, but it seems people want to be oblivious to this. Any priest working in a parish or oratory has to make himself nearly totally available to strangers on a daily/hourly basis - this is not the life for an introvert who does not have strong auxiliary extroversion skills. Religious living in a community are living in a social hothouse that can make small family life seem tame by comparison in terms of stress. (The call to eremetic religious life is comparatively rare, so I would not consider that a typical route to suggest to anyone.)

I am sensitive to this because I've personally witnessed the destruction that can arise from priests who have no aptitude for parish life.

* It's a form of magical thinking about grace. It was typically, in the old days, expressed in the form of "grace of state" - that, if you took vows, God gave you the graces necessary for that state of life - with the incorrect and very unCatholic understanding that graces would override nature (rather than build on nature), magically transfiguring peoples' characters. It's a pernicious piety.

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Be upfront and speak solely to your feelings. (You can entirely omit any characterization of how you perceive him or his posse.)

There's an old universal widget of etiquette that comes highly recommended by none other than the original Emily Post. When you want to decline to do something someone is asking you to do, you say some version of "It's simply not possible." One might call it a Bartleby (the Scrivener) type of no that is emphatically NOT seeking to be negotiated into yes - it conspicuously avoids providing reasons/explanations (and apologies other than the most cursory and bland should also be avoided, else they be turned into a negotiation.)

Etiquette is a useful set of tools for the socially awkward to feel more confident when dealing with the socially assured.

I think if you are "blunt" and "to the point" you will be less open to misinterpretation, which is good. As for people gossiping about you or your intentions, this is out of your control.

People in my congregation wondered if I was married to our organist. We began at the same time and we are both very tall, so maybe this is where they got the idea? One woman actually asked me about it. I had to laugh since the organist is fifteen years my junior and my husband and I had been married for a decade and had four children by then (and yes, he came to church with me every Sunday.)

People will say what they want and see what they want. You continue to lead the upstanding, holy life you have described above and all will be made clear soon enough. I too would not want to hang out with a group of "blokes" sans ladies, so you are not alone.

Right. Don't worry as much about turning him down gently as turning him down quickly, politely, and very clearly.

There's a terrible school of old Catholic piety that should not be permitted to take root in new traditionalist communities.

I know the phenomenon of which you speak, Liam. I think it's fair to say that in the U.S., there might be a tendency for Catholic traditionalists to adopt wholesale preconciliar social mores and attitudes. While this isn't always bad, I've seen some attitudes among "Latin Mass Catholics" that would have been best left in the cultural ash heap.

Recently, a young lady, now married and in her mid-twenties, who was raised for most of her life in a very conservative/traditionalist, "alt-Right" atmosphere in the northeast and the south, came out on Facebook and publicly denounced the many cases of sexism and actual abuse she has seen in traditionalist communities and parishes. It wasn't a pretty list.

It's a very complex subject, and I don't claim to understand it at all, and of course, elitist, arrogant attitudes and social dysfunction aren't limited to EF communities, by a long shot. I just tend to think that in America there is a certain mindset that has caused a great deal of damage, and though it was probably there before a certain prelate arrived on the scene in the 80's and 90's, I think he may have done a great deal to foster its growth, from what I remember of his infamous letters to the laity written some decades ago when he was rector of the seminary at Winona.

I'm sorry to introduce a little levity into this conversation, but reading a description of this personage, I can't chase the image of Jane Austen's Mr. Collins.

Oh, yeah.

"It's simply not possible for me to talk with you now. Have a lovely day." Move forward without looking back.

On downtown abbey servants who are cornered often say, "Now I must get on with my day" or "Heavens, look at the time." I wish I'd had those expressions handy when I spent time in a choir loft. I know a very successful director who just turns stoney faced when he's done listening--but that's probably not what you want.

Have you considered a grappling hook? You could get out of dodge Batman-style.

The 'trapped in the loft' syndrome is very real! I make it a point to be available after services to receive any potential feedback, but often can't make it down to coffee hour in time, as there are folks who love to pin me to the organ bench after services—generally to say kind things, occasionally to make uninformed comments, and in one case by a women in the choir who has a crush on me (she is harmless). In all cases I have always felt it my duty to be as polite as possible—a lot of smiling and nodding, even when what is being offered is utter nonsense, or (in the rare case) downright insulting—as these are the folks I am serving.

Having said, I have complete sympathy with your present case!

donr, you are describing something very temporary (visitors), while jesearle is discussing something that happens in an ongoing way.

As in any helping profession, dependencies happen in choirs. In a therapeutic context, this is normal and natural. But most of us aren't equipped for doing therapy, and in any case the choir loft isn't the right place for that.

Being clear but polite and friendly makes you "teflon" for people who are needy. One of the main reasons not to be pulled into their drama is because it would be inappropriate and unkind, because we're not trained to help.

(This is obviously different from concrete forms of help that anyone can do, like giving rides or lending money for the pancake breakfast, or the kinds that we are trained to do, like voice advice.)

like giving rides

If you're an employee of a church, you need to check with the Diocese before doing something like this. We have policies in place that forbid church employees from giving rides to anyone where one would be alone in a car with someone.

At one of the churches I go to on occasion, the loft is always open, for anyone to come. Even when the choir is there. Just not the organ, only students (like me) who come to practice or performers are allowed to use it. He likes people, and especially those interested in music.

Okay I should specify again... I'm not against people coming and saying hi. But when it is people who are dangerous or unwanted what do you do?

@donr what if that person is someone suffering the negative effects of "ice" from a drug addicted community? (which whilst my parish doesn't have this problem the location of the church in the wider community is unfortunate.)
As a woman I feel very threatened when a scary type man comes up to the loft with an unfriendly face or creepy sense of personal space. I have had to call my choir friend to come up and rescue me from a man that kept touching my hair and saying really creepy things. It is a really bad idea to be locked upstairs with that.
If it is someone saying hi I have no problem but I'm in a position where these instances are mostly people that aren't normal like that.

@MarkS I understand so much but I don't think choir girls with crushes are harmless, their actions and intentions might be but association alone with them isn't so harmless. I once was the friend asked by a conductor to stay behind so he could avoid being alone with the girl that would stay behind. It was purely to protect his reputation. Sadly as a music teacher in a girls school I've seen too often a girl get rejected by a male teacher and then make his life into a misery. Not at all suggesting that this particular girl would but some do.

@matthewj I'm the one playing the postlude which is why I'm last down. I have in past foreseen an issue and asked a chorister or two to stay behind. Beer is a more important factor than the postlude for some... And I totally understand that.

Church security is a real issue, and there are measures you can take to prevent dangerous situations, minimize the harm they cause, or respond afterward. Here's a short paper about the topic:
http://churchsecurityconsultant.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/DaleAnnis-E-Book032011.pdf

Of course, what measures you adopt would depend on the particular situation of your church and the risks.

Could an air horn come in handy?

At my current church I actually encourage folks to come up to the balcony during the postlude—folks (especially kids) love to see what my feet are up to! While this might encourage some folks to view the postlude (and therefore the music generally?) as a form of entertainment, rather than a fitting conclusion to worship, it also helps to foster interest in the organ and organ music, which I think in this day and age is a good thing! So I suppose in that way I am creating my own loft 'traffic' issues. Is this a practice anywhere else?

Tried an experiment with closing the loft door and it worked. The girls still came and asked more politely than usual if they could play. Wasn't boxed in.

also an aside about my new special friend...
Found out a seminarian had told the bloke he didn't have to be mean to women to become a priest hahaha.