• daniel
    Posts: 75
    If one is trying to do chant and polyphony for Easter, how does one incorporate trumpet into that? Pastor and parishioners expect trumpets on Easter. Use them only for prelude/postlude/incidental music? Seems like a waste of trumpeter's time and parish money.
  • You can program double-choir pieces by the Gabrielis and their German students and have your choir sing Choir I and have the organ and trumpet/brass be Choir II.
  • Blaise
    Posts: 439
    Oh, I would love to hear trumpets on Easter/Vigil! Now, mind, I already go to a nice church which uses organ and polyphony, but I am working on trumpet playing so that next year (2010) I can pitch the idea to Mr. Murray and Fr. Phillips to incorporate solo trumpet/brass choir.
  • Jscola30
    Posts: 116
    In relation to D.B. Page's post I recall doing a settting of Haec Dies (This is the day the Lord has made) for double choir where a brass ensemble can take the second choir part. Might have been one of the pieces D.B. Page is referring to, but I forget the composer.

    Is all the vocal music strictly chant and polyphony? I would say if you're doing at least a processional and reccional hymn, there's a place they can be used. If you're doing O sons and Daughters, arranged metrically could also be a place for the trumpet to join in on the refrain.
  • One thing to consider is the Introit on Easter Sunday, which is more about mystery and awe that trumpet blasts. The trumpet thing doesn't really appear in the liturgical year until two weeks later on Jubilate. Musicians should consider educating their pastors on this point.
  • Pes
    Posts: 623
    Why not use trumpets to intone the chants, before they are intoned with words?
  • Jeffry: I agree with your statement regarding the character of Easter as established through the introit. I have quieted down my Easter music years ago. I think historically speaking the apostles and Mary were very distressed and confused at the initial news of the resurrection. Currently when I express my belief Jesus' resurrection during a casual conversation it always has a too, too profound effect on the direction of the discussion. Therefore we use music that expresses these more serious and exciting moods. Ironically our favorite hymn is "Singer sing and TRUMPETS play !" -
    (I really enjoyed your 12 tone vacuum cleaner video)
  • Daniel : you could use false bordons as intonations and interludes. When I used brass they did not play during the singing except for maybe a gentle descant by one muted horn, but the interludes and introductions were elaborate.
  • Ralph wrote:
    the apostles and Mary were very distressed and confused

    ...but that was because they didn’t know what we know now...?

    The existence of substantial, non-happy-trumpets Easter music notwithstanding (“Victimæ” and its musical progeny esp.), I am skeptical of the idea that there is much liturgical tradition behind holding off on fanfare until 2 (or, in the OF, 3) weeks after Easter Sunday. I’m open to it and would be interested to read more, but it seems to me that we would all hear of “Jubilate Sunday” more prominently were that the case.
  • What was Easter like in Catholic churches in the period 1700-1950? [Obviously like many things ... ]
    The expectation that Easter should be a particularly ornate and elaborate solemnity is logical and reasonable.
    What's not clear is how this can and should be expressed.
    I don't know where and when the 'trumpets at Easter' custom originated and became ubiquitous.
    Because trumpets are 'native' to only the most elaborate orchestral/polychoral/concertated genres of purely Catholic music, my first hypothesis is that the Easter brass custom is mostly closely connected to Protestant hymn-singing.

    Maybe an expert in Funerary Violin would know.
  • Blaise
    Posts: 439
    Well, it is a good custom, as long as we don't go overboard (overshadow the singing etc.). Besides, it fits in well with the organ, which has a very lengthy span of existence in Catholic Churches.

    If the movies are correct, the trumpet (or some variant thereof) was used in ancient times to announce the arrival of royalty. It seems therefore logical that it could likewise be used in welcoming the arrival of our God-King-Reedemer. Notice I said "could," not necessarily "should." With organ and voices is always acceptable in the Latin church, as of course, is strict a capella---all of this assuming, of course, that the music doesn't stink, whatever choice of mediums of music are used. I'll leave that to y'all to figure that out.
  • my 12-tone vacuum cleaner video? tell me more.
  • JDE
    Posts: 588
    Behold, I tell you a mystery: we shall not all sleep, but we shall be changed in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet.

    (V I)

    Dum-ta-DUMMMM ta-dum-ta-DUMMMM (you know the rest); then the bass soloist sings,

    The trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible; and we shall be changed. (cf. I Cor. 15:51-53)

    Handel aside, I reckon that passage might have something to do with the "Trumpets at Easter" tradition.
  • Blaise
    Posts: 439
    I reckon, as well.
  • Blaise
    Posts: 439
    Your 12 tone vacuum cleaner video? I want to hear more of this.
  • henry
    Posts: 241
    Daniel Bennett Page made me think when he said "my hypothesis is that the Easter brass custom is most closely associated with Protestant hymn singing." I tend to agree - I always get that feeling when I hear this music, whether live or on promotional CD's from companies like GIA, WLP, etc. Televised Masses from St. Peter's in Rome are almost always choir and organ, even on the most solemn occasions, right? Maybe we should take our cue from them.
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    Funny. I did a google search for "12 tone vacuum cleaner". Guess what came up?
  • ghmus7
    Posts: 1,464
    Ok, When else during the liturgical year can you justify to the pastor the expense of hiring brass?
  • Christmas and Pentecost seem like good candidates...?
  • Jscola30
    Posts: 116
    Maybe also during a Confirmation or First Communion?
  • Blaise
    Posts: 439
    Gavin,

    LOL! just did a google search a minute ago.
  • Blaise
    Posts: 439
    Much Protestant hymnology is good. Much Catholic hymnology is not. Let's make an exchange, shall we?

    That being said, I've never heard of trumpets beings used during Confirmation or First Communion, except of course, during the Vigil of the Resurrection and in those churches which regularly use them.

    "Come Holy Ghost" could be used with organ, and with a little stretch, maybe a decent brass group.
  • Th is is what I meant: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LACCAF04wSs 12 tone commercial
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,933
    The only trumpets I will be using are part of the organ. And you are right about many Protestant hymns being superior to widely-used Catholic hymns.
  • OK as a brass player, I'm gonna stick by the use of our beautiful instruments for Easter. Lots of opportunities. They can do lots in the Ordinary form with 4-hymn sandwich, but in the EF or in more traditional OFs with Propers, they can play prelude music (lots of good trumpet and organ pieces out there), concerted baroque music of Gabrieli, Schutz (although I prefer cornettos) but especially the wonderful repertoire from St Peter's in Bologna (Torelli and his friends). There was a superb trumpet ensemble at that cathedral in the late 1600s-early 1700s. Good trumpet music from the same time period in Vienna and Kromeriz as well. Don't forget the modern era as well. Now, that said, why don't you hire a whole brass ensemble (I don't like quintets for church work, the tuba is a bit much. I prefer 2 trpts, 2 tbns).
  • JDE
    Posts: 588
    If you check the Bible again, you'll notice that the kol ha shofar (voice of the [ram's-horn] trumpet) is a big part of the festival days:

    tik'u va chodesh shofar ba chese hayom chageinu . . . blow ye the trumpet in the new moon. Ps 81 (I think). There are LOADS of references all over the OT that mention the trumpet as an instrument for celebration, for a call to repentance, and to announce a prophecy (cf. Ezra/Nehemiah). In the NT it is mentioned prominently in the Apocalypse, where John refers to the voice of God as "a voice like a trumpet." It also seems to herald the resurrection of the dead that we all expect at the end of time.

    For these and many other reasons, I don't think it is legitimate to exclude brass players from the Sanctuary on Easter. Do what you will, fellow DOMs -- just don't claim that it's the Church's instruction or God's will when it's a Geschmackssache (matter of taste). In my own situation we can't afford trumpets, and the high school players are not yet advanced enough to play.

    Of course there is also the matter of the Biblical trumpet (at least in the OT, and wherever the trumpet is in a Jewish context) being made of a natural ram's horn, and the fact that including metal in or on the horn makes it treif; but I don't really see anyone learning to play the shofar well enough to do hymn descants. As far as I can tell from my experience, it only plays three notes.
  • I've often used trumpets for Confirmation: the families appreciate this important day being dressed up musically.
    The poor quality of hymnody originating in recent decades in the Catholic Church does not lead to the conclusion that Protestant hymnody should play a central role in Catholic church music.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,668
    I hate to make you all jealous, but I have a trumpet/cornet/flugelhorn built into my congregation and he wants to play as often as possible. I certainly like brass for the high holy days, but having brass all the time would seem to downplay the special days when we have it. Thoughts? Also, we have timpani and built in percussionists. Any thoughts on the use of timp throughout the year (when, etc.?)
  • Blaise
    Posts: 439
    Daniel,

    Fair enough.