chant transposition for purposes of learning, any problem?
  • bonniebede
    Posts: 756
    I need to teach 'Stabat Mater' to a new choir, who are only learning the beginings of solfege, and reading music notation. Because we have to prepare to sing at Mass, I need to give them some music they cannot yet read, though they will have no problem learning it by ear. My aim is always to work within the limits of what they can read, but ideal is meeting reality here.
    With the Stabat Mater, as it is written starting with Fa sol la, means coping with a 'te'.If I transpose it to do re mi, that will make it closer to what they are capable of reading.
    Is there any reason I shouldn't do this? Just until their skill set develops.
  • Jeffrey Quick
    Posts: 2,086
    They're reading modern notation, right? else it wouldn't be an issue. And fixed Do, likewise?
    I find that it's easier to let modern notation be strictly at pitch, and let square notes move. If you aren't using square notes, you'll want to pitch the piece where they can sing it, even if it means adding a te. Singers get a kinetic feel for where notes are, and when they aren't there, the results aren't good.If Do were moveable, te wouldn't be an issue either.
    Thanked by 2Andrew_Malton canadash
  • Andrew_Malton
    Posts: 1,187
    I agree from experience : I feel uncomfortable singing modern notation not at the notated pitch, but entirely free to sing square notes at any pitch. You can get used to any practice in time, I guess. I can't play neumes rapidly on a keyboard, at any pitch, because no need, not used to it.
  • bonniebede
    Posts: 756
    okay, sorry I think I was not clear. We are singing with chant notation. I want to transpose , not because of the pitch it is being sung at,, that will be wherever it needs to be, moveable do and all that.
    It is because as yet from the point of view of learning to read chant notation, we will have studied do to so, but not so to high do, or te.
  • ClergetKubiszClergetKubisz
    Posts: 1,912
    According to everything said so far, transposition shouldn't be a problem.
    Thanked by 3bonniebede JonLaird canadash
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,193
    Is this what you would like, Bonnie?

    Stabat Mater.pdf
    15K
    Thanked by 1bonniebede
  • JonLaird
    Posts: 245
    Since my wife teaches Ward, I understand the dilemma! CK is correct -- transposing won't pose any problems with pitch relationships, assuming with your choir you can deal with the dip to ti & la below "low do." I'm guessing that you would rather deal with that than have to explain te.
    Thanked by 1bonniebede
  • Arthur Connick
    Posts: 496
    I suggest fixing the sheet music (if you plan to have people use it) along the lines of the attachment. Otherwise a lot of people will get confused.
    StabatMater_1424_trans_lgF6.pdf
    51K
    Thanked by 1bonniebede
  • bonniebede
    Posts: 756
    Thank you all so much! That is exactly what I had in mind - it will still be beyond them in terms of what they can sight sing, but not quite so far.
    Thank you both for going to the trouble of supplying music, and thanks jon,ck, jeffrey and andrew for the advice.
    I shall push on with confidence.
    Now the only question is... I am printing the music in the leaflet for the congregation, do I give it to them straight, on the presumption that anyone who is reading it from the notation will be able to do so? I think the answer to that is yes.
  • MichaelDickson
    Posts: 419
    I would print it with the square notes. Doing so could have the long-term benefit of setting your congregation up for being able to follow more complex Gregorian melodies.
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,193
    The tune STABAT MATER (Mainz) is from the Mainz Gesangbuch of 1661, and is actually not a "Gregorian" tune at all. It is a major key tune, often published in the key of F major, hence having 1 flat (B flat) in the key signature. This converts well enough to square note notion using Doh clef with a flatted "ti" ("te") in the key signature. Transposing it to C major (no accidentals in the key signature), is a simple matter, and the transposed square note scores of mine and Arthur Connick's are the result.

    In singing from either of these two transposed scores, it is unlikely that the pitch of Doh will be near C; instead, the pitch of Doh is more likely to be near F.
    Thanked by 3Arthur Connick bonniebede JonLaird
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