Our Loving God : New Hymn : by Koerber (free to all)
  • francis
    Posts: 10,848
    Happy (liturgical) New Year.

    Hear A Simulation

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    Note: Hymn music was composed in 1981 and I just remembered it and thought to share it with all.
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,199
    Quite nice!!
  • francis
    Posts: 10,848
    Someone raised an objection to the theology of the Donne verse.

    What is your take on this?

    Are you sure it is sound to use John Donne's eucharist poem in a hymn? It seems he rejected the dogma of transubstantiation very clearly, as the quotations on pp. 27-28 of this book show:

    https://books.google.com/books?id=Q6MFyTqy0DwC&lpg=PA28&ots=o0FBs6Q4HO&dq=john donne transubstantiation&pg=PA28#v=onepage&q=john donne transubstantiation&f=false

    His poem isn't an affirmation of the Catholic doctrine, but a dismissal of it, as if to say only: whatever Jesus meant by His words at the Last Supper is fine with me.


  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    That poem by Donne is, without a doubt, the most famous bit of Anglican Eucharistic theology. Whatever Donne meant by it, it has been accepted by Anglicans of nearly every stripe as a way of understanding a multi-variate eucharistic theology:
    "I don't know what Jesus meant, but whatever he meant is what I believe."
  • francis
    Posts: 10,848
    Hmmmm....

    OK I think I'm understanding what he is saying in this verse now. Is this verse being sarcastic towards the theology of transubstantiation? If so, then perhaps I should revise his verse to reflect Catholic thinking which is that Jesus WAS speaking about transubstantiation.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    I wouldn't call it sarcasm.

    It's probable he was being a bit antagonistic toward what he saw as a Romish tendency to explain things in detail that cannot be explained. This is the same period when Protestants start accusing scholastics of debating how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

    Most Anglicans today take the quote relatively sincerely, and see it as a way to sum up the wide range of belief present in Anglicanism, and express with humility, the inability to know the mechanism of Eucharistic grace.

    I don't think the verse is salvageable for use by Roman Catholics who accept not only the doctrine of Transubstantiation, but --- more broadly --- the notion that doctrinal truth can be codified by the Magisterial authority of the Church.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,848
    In that case, I wrote two new verses. "Take it and Sing it!" (You are what you eat... you believe what you sing.)


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