Mystery of Faith
  • I have been looking for some vernacular options for the Mystery of Faith that are simple chanted tunes. I have already looked at the Chabanel options (very nice) and am thinking of beginning to use the one set to the tune of Stabat Mater... I was wondering what other folks are using out there that don't involve the MoC.
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    The option in By Flowing Waters is excellent. I also recommend David Hurd's New Plainsong Mass.
  • Those in BFW are very nice... and quite similar to the Latin Mysterium Fidei melody... it could work well toward getting the faithful ready for Latin! Thanks, Gavin. Haven't looked at the Hurd melodies yet...

    I have tried my hand at putting simple Office Psalm tones to the words... could you critique? I am new to it... oops problems with pdf file.
  • I am having difficulty with my CutePDF writer... just got a new computer for Christmas... re-loaded my Meinrad font and have written a couple of things. Downloaded the free CutePDF software (that worked fine on the old computer). When I try to make a pdf file from a word doc. with meinrad font stuff... it gives me a series of bar-code type lines on the page... (see above pdf file for an example - heh). If I take the same file created on the new computer, copy to a thumb drive... use the other computer (with CutePDF software) to make the pdf file, it works just fine.

    Any ideas why the new CutePDF download won't work for Meinrad chant font docs? Any ideas?
  • by chance is this vista? Some people are having Meinrad trouble on Vista. Another thing is to set your PDF to embed the fonts, and play with other settings on the program.
  • While it is not chant, the Community Mass setting by Proulx (sp) has an alternative for Christ has died (hopefully this acclamation will leave soon once the new translations are all approved). He uses "when we eat this Bread...".

    My PV uses "when we eat this Bread" as a chant for daily Mass. For lack of sound, this is the best approximation I can do:

    When we eeeat this bread and driiink this cup, we proclaim your death Loord Jeesus, until you coooome in glooory.

    I have heard this setting as a memroial acclamation during a Papal Mass. I like the "Salvator mundi, salvanos, qui per crucem et resurrectionem tuam liberasti nos." I heard it tonight on the replay of today's Papal Mass.
  • B-gal... I can almost hear it in my head, thanks to your talented typing :) I did put it to music using Meinrad... once I get this pdf thing figured out, I'll send it to you to see if I got it right :) Thanks! I'm making up a single page sheet with many different options for our pastor to choose from.

    Jeffrey... it is Vista, but then, so was the old computer where it works fine... do you think this will be solvable if I spring for the full version, rather than the free download version that I've been using?
  • miacoyne
    Posts: 1,805
    One of our priest who is very peculiar about words don't like our singing just 'bread." He says it confuses people, especially these days. He prefers bread of life, bread of heaven, or something that says more than just bread. What do you think?
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 10,494
    Miacoyne, I think your priest is right. It seems that these days, we have people building the faith community, bearing fruit, loving one another, and breaking bread. Sad to say, all these words and phrases are tainted. The result is that Catholics have become fuzzy-minded idiots who have no idea what the Church actually teaches. Come Lent, when we switch to Latin mass parts, we will be singing, "Mortem tuam..." Damn the Mass of Creation, full steam ahead. ;-)
  • I can't remember from the new translation... is option C (When we eat this bread...) still in the list of options. I am thinking option A (Christ has died...) is gone in the new translation, right? I seem to remember your posting a link to the new translation, Mia. Perhaps this issue will be taken care of by the new translation and will help when using the vernacular.

    I'd love to go straight to the Mortem tuam... , too. We're taking small steps toward that goal :)

    Mia, if you have that link, could you post it again?
  • miacoyne
    Posts: 1,805
    I'll try to find it. It is in US bishops web and some others here also posted a few month ago. I believe 'When we eat this bread' is one of the option, but it's the priest who choose to use it or not? Also there's a rumor that 'Christ has died' might be back. (I guess it became so popular, and they don't want to be embarassed that it got in our Liturgy. Sorry I shouldn't be saying this.)
    We have a good excuse to go to Latin directly, since it is confusing which one will make the final selection, maybe you can ask your priest whether you can just use Latin? Our children's schola sings this all the time.(it's one their best :) This is simple and short and goes well with two-note humble Amen that follows.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 10,494
    Is there an official English translation for "mortem tuam." It's been many years since I studied Latin, so what would be the best literal translation?
  • I was surprised to find in my Gregorian Missal that the Mortem tuam is not accurately translated... and my meager abilities would not allow me to attempt it. But it is obvious to me that form A: "Christ has died, Christ is risen, Christ will come again" does not match! And... upon looking at the other three vernacular forms, it seems none matches exactly. That being said, I think any of the other three would be a welcome change from the simple A form.

    The BFW melodies to which the vernacular forms have been set are very close to the Mortem tuam, however. They would be a good choice, I think, if the goal was to move the parish close to the Latin (and eventually sneak it in?). They would already know the melody, so it should be very easy...
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 8,232
    "We declare your death, O Lord,
    and we confess your resurrection,
    until you come."
  • My contribution, which I fuss with and then ignore every few years, and which merely proves the futility of this sort of chant adaptation, probably.
  • miacoyne
    Posts: 1,805
    I don't know why the translation of 'Mortem Tuam' in Gregorian Missal is like that. Maybe the book is refering to what is commonly said (or sung), not the exact translation?
  • Richard... those are beautiful... thank you so much!
  • WGS
    Posts: 239
    On page 6 of the Foreward of my Gregorian Missal:

    "Alongside the Latin prayers, in a second column, have been placed the corresponding texts of the official liturgical translation for English speaking countries. These were created for the needs of the vernacular liturgy and they are printed here in conformity with official directives, even though they do not always constitute a literal, word for word rendering of the Latin."

    So, if you're looking for a literal translation of the chants in the Gregorian Missal, Solesmes says look elsewhere.

    Does anyone use the English language Memorial Acclamation settings by the Rev. Joseph Roff? For each of the four common acclamations, the celebrant's intonation is recto tono. The acclamations themselves are arranged for Congregation and SATB with the congregation part sticking close to the soprano line. My copies are copyrighted 1970 and marked as G-1546 from GIA.
  • Mark M.Mark M.
    Posts: 632
    Richard… another thanks here!
  • Mark M.Mark M.
    Posts: 632
    The translation in the Parish Book of Chant, all of which is prefaced with the disclaimer "the English translations given are literal, and are not intended for liturgical use," is
    We proclaim Thy death, O Lord, and we confess Thy resurrection, until Thou comest.
  • "The translation in the Parish Book of Chant..."

    ...which we made up, I think...
  • Those are all beautiful settings of the English, richard. thank you