Let's get real about organist pay
  • Hildegard
    Posts: 30
    Ok, so there's the AGO scale and there's what most Catholic Churches pay their organists. Beyond the guidelines, I'd appreciate anything you're comfortable sharing about what your organist (not DM, organist only) gets paid and their responsibilities. I'm in the process of putting together a proposed job description and salary for TPTB who made the decision on their own and got what they paid for. Hoping to do better this time.
  • Liam
    Posts: 5,093
    Catholic churches pay their organists? Progress....
  • ClergetKubiszClergetKubisz
    Posts: 1,912
    ...and got what they paid for.


    This explains most of the situations you'll find. Many parishes expect more than what they pay for and for some reason the pastors in those situations do not understand why they can't have it. I have my theories as to why and they revolve around the fact that for so long, there has always been somebody willing to do the job for whatever is being offered (even if nothing is being offered, i.e. for free), and the pastors in question either do not know that they are getting poor(er) quality, or they don't care (we still have music at Mass, don't we?). Our organists (keyboardists, really, and worse we call them accompanists) get $75/service as a stipend, and their only duties are to show up and play on Sundays. They are expected to practice on their own, which most keyboardists will do anyway, as there really is no "faking it" (or at least it's much more obvious when keyboardists are faking, as opposed to cantors, who I have seen arriving at Mass not even knowing what the entrance hymn is, and even improvisation isn't really true improv: it's prepared ahead of time). They are both decent players, but neither of them is professionally trained. The third person is me, and I'm the DM also. I get a part time salary for the DM position, and no stipend for organist duties (supposedly, it's included in my job as DM). The pastor tells me it's "...mostly for financial reasons," i.e. somebody on the financial council said something to the effect of, "...why isn't that new music director playing? What are we paying him for? This is getting expensive."

    Here's a quick recap:

    1. Our "organists" (I'm really the only organist) get $75/service as a stipend.
    2. They are expected to practice and prepare themselves for Mass, and then show up and play.
    3. All choral rehearsal duties are mine as the DM.

    This sums up the real problem we're facing:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsqJFIJ5lLs
    Thanked by 1Elizabeth_Schmitz
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,980
    If I actually needed the money, I would have given up my job years ago. I have long-time friends there, and that is the reason I stay.
  • The range in my area (I've played both regularly and fill-in at six different churches in the last year; currently have one regular parish on Saturday and another regular one on Sunday) goes from $50/Mass to $100/Mass. One of the six parishes (not one of my current regular ones) just boosted its pay to $65/Mass (from $60). They treated it as a big deal, FWIW.

    For the one that pays $100/Mass, the musician is expected to play everything well, show up on time (30-45 minutes ahead, depending on whether the choir is there), and dress professionally -- or what we all strive to do anyway.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,980
    For the one that pays $100/Mass, the musician is expected to play everything well, show up on time (30-45 minutes ahead, depending on whether the choir is there), and dress professionally -- or what we all strive to do anyway.


    I have said that I showed up sober and wearing clothes. Anything more is an extra. LOL.
    Thanked by 2JDE ZacPB189
  • Hildegard
    Posts: 30
    This is helpful. Disheartening, but helpful.

    I'm lucky in some ways in that I have a pastor who is musical enough to tell the difference between good and bad, and who can tell our current person is not up to the task (as above, he's a keyboardist who does his best on the organ - no pedals. Very nice guy, just not an organist). I think Fr. knows he's got caviar taste on a sardine budget, and what we did before wasn't sufficient. I'm hoping maaaaybe we can approach a salmon budget and find some caviar willing to bite in exchange for use of our awesome organ.

    And I'll consider putting wearing clothes in the contract.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    have said that I showed up sober and wearing clothes.


    I'll consider putting wearing clothes in the contract.


    If you only require sobriety, you'll probably get wearing clothes as an added bonus.
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 2,314
    Sometimes I think there are some amongst us who could pull off the playing inebriated without drawing too much attention to themselves and do just as well as if they were sober. Maybe not raging drunk, but tipsy, definitely.
  • Hildegard
    Posts: 30
    Adam, I'm on the west coast in a very blue city. It's best to be specific about such things.
    Thanked by 1Adam Wood
  • Liam
    Posts: 5,093
    Then again, my years in Charlottesville taught me there are some folks whose faculties are sharper when lubricated by alcohol. They tend to be messy, personally.
    Thanked by 3CHGiffen JDE CharlesW
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,193
    Indeed, Liam!
  • Hildegard
    Posts: 30
    The entire college pastime known as beer pong depends on just that premise.
  • How many have organists who, during the time they were working with you, took lessons to improve their skills or at least went to a workshop?
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,980
    Workshops and conventions are fine, if you can afford it or the church will pay for it. Many churches don't pay and the organist salaries are so low they can't afford it. I have said that in my place when I retire, they will either pay for the level of music they want, or they will get the level of music they pay for - much more likely to happen.
  • The question really is, how many organists seek or are encouraged to see education - or are they merely accepted as they are and not encouraged to improve? Why am I asking? I read many complaints about organists performance, but little about those who have taken a positive approach encouraging improvement.

    Is it a waste of time to try to improve an organist who may have been there forever and will probably outlast you?
  • I only work as a substitute on the east coast, but the lowest I've ever played was $75/Mass--and if I were offered that rate by another church I would haggle.