Communion Meditation At Today's Mass
  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    The deacon read the gospel today and then gave a homily. He started with a joke: A minister at the conclusion of one of his sermons said, "If I could gather up all the wine in the world, I would throw it in the river. If I could gather up all the beer in the world, I would throw it in the river." And then with a very grave vocal intonation he said, "If I could gather up all the whiskey in the world, I would throw it in the river." At that point the music minister announced, "For our closing hymn please turn to number 354 as we join in singing, "Shall We Gather At The River".

    OK... so I laughed a little. I don't like jokes during mass, even at the homily, but heh...

    So the Mass continued and we arrived at communion time. The hymn was announced, "One Bread, One Body". When the hymn ended, the organist then began to play "Shall We Gather At The River" on the piano.

    What are your thoughts?
  • ryandryand
    Posts: 1,640
    Funny, but poor taste. I'd do something like that at a party, but not at mass.

    The comment about the hymn was funny, but actually playing it as an instrumental meditation makes a joke out of the sacrament that has just taken place. It's inappropriate to make light of that situation, especially as the congregation is meditating after receiving the sacrament.

    OH SO YOU'RE SAYING THE LITURGY SHOULD BE DULL AND SERIOUS AND DREARY

    No. There is a great joy in it. A great beauty, and a genuine happiness in communion with God. When we've just consumed his body and blood, shed for our sinful ways, its crossed the line of "harmless off-the-cuff humor" to "dreadfully inappropriate" to be meditating on going down to the river to get drunk.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,980
    Sounds like that little company of mass performers have finally lost their minds.
    Thanked by 1canadash
  • Carl DCarl D
    Posts: 992
    The Mona Lisa would also be more amusing with a mustache.
    Thanked by 1Ben
  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    perhaps its more like this?
    monalisaexorcist.jpg
    550 x 600 - 68K
  • ryandryand
    Posts: 1,640
    And a low-cut dress.
  • melofluentmelofluent
    Posts: 4,160
    francis,
    Were you able to make some connection between the not so cute joke and any of the scriptures?
    Sorry, I like true humor even at Mass, but sounds like the deacon's mind showed up to the wedding in a clown costume.
  • PhatFlute
    Posts: 219
    heh heh this has made me laugh.
    Ph
  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    melo

    there really was no connection i don't believe, but I will review the readings again to see.
  • M. Jackson Osborn
    Posts: 8,414
    Um, I'm confused!
    Which was worse?
    The piano at liturgy,
    or what was played on it?

    And, I fail to see anything funny
    about the deacon's bad taste, or the piano, or the song.
    Thanked by 2Adam Wood CHGiffen
  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    MJO:

    I believe all of it borders on sacrilege if it hasn't fallen over the edge.
    Thanked by 1M. Jackson Osborn
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    And, I fail to see anything funny
    about the deacon's bad taste, or the piano, or the song.



    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/funny

    See definitions 3-5.


    3. warranting suspicion; deceitful; underhanded:
    We thought there was something funny about those extra charges.

    4. Informal. insolent; impertinent:
    Don't get funny with me, young man!

    5. curious; strange; peculiar; odd:
    Her speech has a funny twang.
    Thanked by 1Gavin
  • M. Jackson Osborn
    Posts: 8,414
    Well, Adam, you have, with your wonted resourcefulness illustrated for us that there was, indeed, something funny about the deacon, the pianist, the piano, and the song (but only in senses 3, 4, and 5 - plus a sixth sense: daffy, unhinged, missing a screw or having a screw loose: there was something funny about that deacon... the pianist, too!).
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,216
    Even apart from the booze joke, anything that provokes the faithful to laugh during such a sacred time of prayer and sacramental reception is, well, absolutely to be excluded: a very bad practice.
    Thanked by 2M. Jackson Osborn noel jones, aago
  • ryandryand
    Posts: 1,640
    Ought to be Canon Law

    Anything that provokes the faithful to laugh during a sacred time of prayer and sacramental reception is absolutely to be excluded: a very bad practice.
    Thanked by 3francis noel jones, aago Salieri
  • musiclover88
    Posts: 156
    I could see MAYBE doing Shall We Gather at the River as a postlude (though I probably wouldn't do that), but to do it as a Communion meditation is too far. At least as a postlude Mass has already ended.
    Thanked by 1Gavin
  • bonniebede
    Posts: 756
    There was a nice ditty we used to sing at charismatic prayer meetings 'he poured in the oil and the wine, the kind that restoreth my soul' Maybe this would have been more appropriate? ;-)
  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    I will tell you what is appropriate: Either the Te Deum or the Anima Christi or something with the same sentiment. That is all.
  • melofluentmelofluent
    Posts: 4,160
    Inebriate me, O Lord!
    Thanked by 3Adam Wood Gavin Ben
  • RoborgelmeisterRoborgelmeister
    Posts: 174
    I should think what the pianist did would be grounds for termination.
    Thanked by 1noel jones, aago
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    I should think what the pianist did would be grounds for termination.


    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
    Thanked by 1Gavin
  • RoborgelmeisterRoborgelmeister
    Posts: 174
    And the homilist deserves an upbraiding.
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    "I should think what the pianist did would be grounds for termination. "

    Well, it isn't. What is grounds for termination is defying the explicit orders of the pastor. Which I strongly suspect wasn't the case here.

    "And the homilist deserves an upbraiding."

    Again, by whom?

    Does anyone seriously think Pope Francis would not have approved of this?
    Thanked by 1Ben
  • ryandryand
    Posts: 1,640
    What makes you think he would not have found it in poor taste?
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    Because he isn't a Self-absorbed Promethean Neopelagian (like the rest of us).
    Thanked by 3Gavin Salieri musiclover88
  • JulieCollJulieColl
    Posts: 2,465
    . . . nor is he "closed," "at a standstill," hopelessly "attached to his own things and ideas" and---heaven forbid---"wrapped up in doctrine."
    Thanked by 2Gavin Salieri
  • G
    Posts: 1,400
    Ought to be Canon Law

    Well hey, while the synod fathers are feeling...flexible? creative?

    (Save the Liturgy, Save the World)
    Thanked by 3Gavin francis Salieri
  • ryandryand
    Posts: 1,640
    Anything more concrete? Something (besides your personal media-impression), perhaps a quote, that would suggest that he finds humor appropriate at perhaps the most reverent moments in the liturgy - or that he thinks we ought to be joking around in the liturgy at all?

    Keep in mind this is the same guy who has said very clearly:
    -The church is not a gathering space for us to shake hands and smile at friends. Our focus is on God, and MANY PEOPLE HAVE LOST SIGHT OF THAT (yes, he said this).
    -Not everyone who thinks they have a charism is gifted like they think they are, and sometimes it is in the best interest of the liturgy to steer poor singers away from the choir.

    I'm just curious what would make you feel that he would have approved of the "LET'S GO GET DRUNK BY THE RIVER" humor during a time of reverent meditation.
    Thanked by 1Spriggo
  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    ryand

    To whom are you directing the last comment?
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,611
    I was interim organist at a Baptist church for 5 years...a doctor who plays jazz piano filled in for the pianist who was out on an advent Sunday.

    He kept playing little "licks" at the end of hymns. Which was different. Then he closed one hymn with a lick based on Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer.

    I was shocked.

    But then there are people who are unable to separate the sacred from the profane. Like the deacon and the organist at the piano.

    Firing seems too gentle a way to handle this.
    Thanked by 1M. Jackson Osborn
  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    Noel:

    If the the deacon had said something serious about Gathering at the River, it would have been a completely different situation. That fact that the organist PLAYED off a joke and did this during communion meditation is just unbelievable. It is the drawing of attention to the laughable during the most sacred time of the liturgy. The organist may be ignorant to the nth degree and not realize the stupidity with which he is acting, but this shows an incredible lack of ability to fill the office of a DoM in the RC tradition. It is just unbelievable. Hence, why I go to Spanish Mass these days.
  • TimTheEnchanterTimTheEnchanter
    Posts: 206
    The organist may be ignorant to the nth degree and not realize the stupidity with which he is acting, but this shows an incredible lack of ability to fill the office of a DoM in the RC tradition.


    As far as you know, did anyone speak to the organist about this? Because if this was a one-time thing, it seems to me that it calls for polite but firm correction and a reminder of what the liturgy is for. We could go back and forth as to whether this organist should have known, but it sure seems possible that the organist didn't, and maybe polite correction would be helpful.

    If this guy's a repeat offender, that's different, of course.

    Incidentally, this reminds me of a story another organist once told me -- he was improvising as the offertory was finishing and played something that he realized (after he finished) was a familiar melody, but he couldn't remember which one. It was only later that he realized he had been playing the theme song to "The Brady Bunch." He was, uh, a little embarrassed.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,216
    Well, that tune is famously similar to "Here I Am, Lord", so it's likely no one even noticed!

  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    Also, he was playing a tune without knowing what he was playing. This guy was playing a tune to remind us of a joke about throwing all the booze in the world into a river.

    Also, I never mentioned the problem that it would be a crime to dump expensive scotch into the river... probably a mortal sin.
  • ryandryand
    Posts: 1,640
    To whom are you directing the last comment?


    Gavin, or anyone who believes that Pope Francis would not have disapproved of this practice - Gavin's comment, I believe, asking incredulously if we could seriously believe Francis would not have approved.

    I am curious about what makes one feel that way.
  • M. Jackson Osborn
    Posts: 8,414
    '...would be a crime to dump expensive scotch into the river...'

    Um, would this be because it would pollute the river, or the scotch!?
    Actually, about a hundred or more years ago this would have made a very tasty crystal clear, pebble-strewn river. Not so, nowadays.... then, on the other hand, the scotch might now actually purify an otherwise unpotable morass!
  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    MJO

    The waste, the waste, the waste, the crime, the crime, the crime.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    In the Big Rock Candy Mountains
    You never change your socks
    And the little streams of alcohol
    Come trickling down the rocks

    The brakemen have to tip their hats
    And the railway bulls are blind
    There's a lake of stew
    And of whiskey too
    You can paddle all around them
    In a big canoe
    In the Big Rock Candy Mountains.
    Thanked by 3TimTheEnchanter melofluent CHGiffen
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    Francis, MJO, Adam,

    If you haven't read The Flying Inn, by G. K. Chesterton, you must read it. It has a poem called Wine and Water within an otherwise engrossing story about one Irishman's quest to rescue England from her aristocracy.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    The waste,
    The waste
    To pour the wine
    Into the murky flow
    To watch the joy
    Of all men's hearts
    Go lapping down
    the Gorge.

    The pain,
    The pain
    To see the beer
    Head bobbing down the Rhine
    Like murdered victim
    dumped for dead
    My precious,
    What a crime.

    The Scotch!
    The Scotch!
    No, NOT the Scotch!
    Please drop it by my pad-
    Then go and jump
    Into a lake
    And make me very, very, very
    very, very glad!




  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    [Video of dancing after Mass deleted by admin. At the end of the video, the narrator urges people to leave the Catholic Church in favor of schismatic groups. (I'd have left it in otherwise.)]
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    Yikes! Didn't see that, Sorry!

    (There was a video with the title in Spanish - thought this was the same thing, just with English title!)
  • melofluentmelofluent
    Posts: 4,160
    Can you say "Santeria?"
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    Bill,

    Am I understanding that someone at Mass said "don't come back.... join x" or the omniscient video narrator said something like "this is what happens at novus ordo Mass, so come join group x"

    God bless,

    Chris
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    the omniscient video narrator said something like "this is what happens at novus ordo Mass, so come join group x"

    That.
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