Interesting way to visualize
  • mrcoppermrcopper
    Posts: 653
    Ryan, I've seen these before, but don't know how to make them ... could the process be altered to include intonation? You make a perfect interval green, say, a major consonance blue, minor pink, dissonance yellow ... ?
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,193
    I've seen them before, too. In fact, I thought I saw them here (but I may be mistaken).
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    MrCopper:

    image
  • ryandryand
    Posts: 1,640
    mrcopper,

    That's an interesting idea, but would be difficult to execute. From where do we measure the interval?

    With, for example, a major triad in 3 voices (BAS) - What color is the bass note? Is the soprano green because it is a major 5th (or 12th) above? Or is it purple because it is a minor 3rd above the alto?

    etc.
  • ChoirpartsChoirparts
    Posts: 147
    Another intersting idea is the fine training webpage of the St Mary's Singers out of Sydney.

    http://stmaryssingers.com/all-titles.html

    as well as their Youtube site : https://www.youtube.com/user/StMSSyd/featured
    Thanked by 1JulieColl
  • If every interval is calculated from the bass note, as in figured bass, the bass note could stay the same color throughout. I say it can be done and wouldn't be surprised if it's been done already.
  • ryandryand
    Posts: 1,640
    What about in sections where the bass rests, and perfect intervals exist between other voices? Do you then color whatever the "new bass" is as the lowest color?
  • Seems fair. If it can be described, I'm sure it can be programmed; at least that's a nice maxim to have.
  • mrcoppermrcopper
    Posts: 653
    Ben, you are channeling an inner Adam?

    As to what colors: get harmonic: tonic is a color, dominant another, subdominant another, mediant another. When we modulate, the new tonic gets its color, modified by the original tonic: eg., the original blue tonic becomes new turquoise tonic, and the original red dominant becomes new green+red (?brown?) dominant.

    And I ask again, how do you do this? Is is something so crude as midi-note-number to color?
  • It can be as simple as note numbers > algorithm > colors. Or, if you're into signal processing, sound > fft > algorithm > colors. As for color schemes, perhaps Partch's Chromelodium scheme could be employed. Plaid would be nice, too.
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,193
    The source in the example above is evidently from a MIDI sequence (since the playback smacks of MIDI synthesis), which (since notes and durations are just numbers), is easy enough for a computer graphics geek to process into what you see.

    A year or so ago (when I first saw examples such as that above), I began to experiment with what I might be able to do within Finale - no fancy colors (yet now), just something that would play back nicely in the Scroll View. It has worked pretty well for visualizing (in another way than via usual Western notation).

    Just to give an idea of what it looks like when printed, attache here is the Finale 2014 score of my 6-part Ave verum corpus in "Linear Flow" format, stripped of all text underlay and other markings (text in particular would mess up the steady flow of the music). I would upload the Finale .musx file if I could so that people with Finale 2014 could play back the result in Scroll View; however, since that isn't possible, I can email the .musx source file to anyone who is interested.

    Here are the more conventional PDF score and MP3 sound file - the score for comparison with the Linear Flow version, and the sound file for listening to as you follow along in the Linear Flow score.

    Note: I'll probably work on tweaking the results some in the near future. In fact, I've already uploaded a version with colored notes (instead of the black notes).
    Giffen-Ave verum corpus-Linear flow.pdf
    90K
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  • mrcoppermrcopper
    Posts: 653
    It doesn't look as cool on paper (pdf); I tried something like this for printed page tuning
    pitch graph
    image
    Not much interest in this method, as far as I could tell, and it's a lot of work to produce.
  • mrcoppermrcopper
    Posts: 653
    Chuck your pdf link does not seem to work: I end up at cpdl home page
  • mrcoppermrcopper
    Posts: 653
    Choirparts, the St Mary's Singers site gives voice parts plunked out on a piano: not so useful, imo. Am I missing something?
    Thanked by 1Choirparts
  • ChoirpartsChoirparts
    Posts: 147
    Charles is correct regarding the source being a midi sequence. Youtube has several sites using this format. The creators use files from public domain midi files. I do not understand the value for training purposes, but viewers seem to enjoy watching the notes.
    Mr Copper... I like your page display.
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,193
    The original links were to the scores hosted at CPDL. They used to work, but something has changed, probably with the recent MediaWiki update there. I've replaced the links with links to copies here. You can also find the score and sound file (a better bit-rate for the MP3) at CPDL.
  • ChoirpartsChoirparts
    Posts: 147
    While many music software programs have the ability to scroll or print blocks of notes in color, I am at a loss for a practical application. Do they have a chant application ?. Are they the modern day scrolling "neumes" ?
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,193
    I am at a loss for a practical application. Do they have a chant application ?. Are they the modern day scrolling "neumes" ?

    My initial reaction was (and still is, to some extent) that this is more of a novelty, but perhaps somewhat useful in allowing one to visualize the flow of the vocal lines. This linear flow representation seems rather incompatible with chant notation, precisely because of the "neume" structure that includes the podatus.
    Thanked by 1Choirparts
  • There was a historic practice of scribing DO in green and FA in red, which we have expanded upon in A Gregorian Chant Coloring Book.
  • bonniebede
    Posts: 756
    I have put together some powerpoint presentations of chant music with audio file attached. The visual shows the music, and a transparent red highlighting dot moves from neume to neume as the audio file plays.
    This is for 6-9 year olds, to help them learn to follow the neumes as they sing, not to just pick it up aurally.
    I can't upload the file to here, because it says powerpoint can't be uploaded, but if anyone would like to see them I can email it to you.
    Any comments on this as an idea or technique gratefully received.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,825
    Manuscripts (machine images, engraving, etc.etc.) will only produce a 'grid of understanding' or a guide. The human touch (and intellect) will always be needed to add nuance, and the process will never succeed vice versa.