Antiphons: The Strife Is O'er and O Sons and Daughters

Randolph Nichols

For church musicians simultaneously employed by different denominations (Episcopal and Catholic in my case), it is interesting to compare differences in performance practice of particular hymns. Most forum readers know, for example, that the final phrase of Holy God, We Praise Thy Name (“Infinite thy vast domain . . .”) is not repeated in some Protestant hymnals. The reason is probably lost to history but the variation is of no great musical significance.

The repetition of antiphons after each verse in the hymns The Strive Is O’er and Ye Sons and Daughters is another matter. I find the Episcopalian practice of singing the antiphon only at the beginning and after the last verse, in liturgy of the hours psalmody fashion, to be superior to the Catholic insertion after every verse. Besides avoiding melodic tedium, the story lines of the texts progress more naturally; you anticipate what’s coming next and the antiphon disrupts that.

Though the Catholic practice is thoroughly inbred, I don’t think it’s a habit that can’t be broken. But that would require others agreeing with me. Am I a lone coyote howling on an empty plain?

Salieri

I never repeat the antiphons of The Strife is O'er or Ye Sons and Daughters between verses. (Catholic parish.)

BTW, I strongly suggest giving Chuck's setting a go.

http://www3.cpdl.org/wiki/images/5/59/Giffen-The_strife_is_o%27er.pdf

melofluent

Couldn't ALL GLORY LAUD AND HONOR be added to that list?

Am I a lone coyote howling on an empty plane?

Wow, that's almost too poetic for a Saturday morning, Randolph!

CharlesW

Oooooooohhhhh! I'm fine with what is in the hymnal and see no reason to copy what another denomination does. Given current practice in my parish, I have to stop the entrance hymn when the priest is at the front and ready to begin. Most of those verses in 'sons and daughters' never get sung which kind of ruins the story the hymn tells.

francis

lone coyote... i will remember that one.

francis

Charles... program that one for communion, and let the choir tell the story while the pips process and hear the story.

CharlesW

That's a good idea and I may do that a little later in Easter. I programmed it for Sunday as an entrance hymn since it ties in so much with readings. Also, it is first communion Sunday so I am stuck with "I will raise you up..." Wonder how that would sound with the lone coyote attached? Ooooooohhhhh I will raise you up Oooooooohhhhh.

francis

I always program Sons and Daughters on Thomas Sunday to drive the point home.

As for the anitphon, if you take the piece at a quick enough pace and treat the antiphon as a 'long breath' sung piano (in contrast to changing dynamics on the verses), it actually can be a time for all to reflect on the two stanza verse one has just sung. If treated musically (and more important, artistically), it is another musical option.

ScottKChicago

francis

yea, the yodels... we don't have them in some of our arrangements depending upon which hymnal you are using.

CharlesW

Some hymnals don't have the repeat. It seems the hymn is not the same in various hymnals. Wonder what the original was like?

MaryAnn Carr Wilson

As far as Ye sons is concerned, I'd find it tedious without what musically works well as a refrain. It's Eastertide, and the flowering of so many Alleluias in the propers predates both hymns you mention, so it seems fine to sing the refrain, as one would when singing the Communion antiphon and alternating with verses.

It's fairly natural to look to the Anglicans when contrasting the best of their practices (as Adam often reminds us, it's not all pristine choral glory everywhere!) with the average Catholic parish. The need to copy all things high Anglican is reduced when one encounters Catholic sacred music in its fullness. Anglican practice is mostly inherited- and reduced- Catholic practice, after all.

Speaking for myself, the preoccupation with hymns has left me entirely. After taking in the whole of music sung in the Mass, hymns take their place as devotional add-ons, reinforcements of a kind. They are not essential to the liturgy, though they can be lovely and can bolster faith. I do not get hung up on them in any way, and consider the expectation of the faithful first when programming hymns.

PurpleSquirrel

Yodeling and coyotes, I like this thread!

With O Sons & Daughters, we do take it at a quick pace but instead of singing the antiphon piano, we actually do the opposite. We rock it. Then do the verses in a ballad style. Think Robin Hood and Fryar Tuck. It's different, but it works.

Speaking of Coyotes, we have one that likes to hang around our back yard. He's not the brightest, so we've dubbed him "Meatballs". I wonder what he would think of all our attempts at yodeling...?

francis

I don't know about the yodeling, but is possible that Meatballs could become dinner?

CharlesW

I wonder if Meatballs likes cats? If so, I would like to borrow him for awhile and take him to my sister's house.

MaryAnn Carr Wilson

Lol, Charles!!
We have loud and sneaky coyotes in our neighborhood.
I think they must be tenors...

melofluent

Not to get all eschatological, or just plain scatological....
But what equivilent words to "alleluia" and "hosanna" do the heavenly hosts sing in saecula saeculorum?

PurpleSquirrel

"Gloria"? Um... "Praise the Lord"?
Is this gonna be on the exam?

Melo, please don't go all scatological on us.... Nasty stuff, that.

melofluent

FREUD RULES!
PS, Siggie (Sigmund) works for this plane of existence (must use French pronunciation) should be credited as the inventor of such outlets as "South Park.....rap........Henry Miller....and cable televsion script writers."
Even the Rolling Stones got it right in 68- Glad to meet you, hoped you guessed my name.

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