When additional verses are needed with English Propers?
  • Ralph BednarzRalph Bednarz
    Posts: 493
    During Mass do you continue with
    the verses of the given psalm listed in the ICEL Antiphonal and end up with this:

    16The nations have fallen in the pit which they made;
    their feet have been caught in the snare they laid.
    17The LORD has revealed himself; he has given judgment.
    The wicked are snared by the work of their hands.

    18Let the wicked go down to the grave,
    all the nations forgetful of God:
    19for the needy shall not always be forgotten,
    nor the hopes of the poor ever perish.
    20Arise, O LORD, let human strength not prevail!
    Let the nations be judged before you.
    21Strike them with terror, O LORD;
    let the nations know they are but men.

    I have sung some entire psalms and I rather like the full range of emotions yet I know that
    four psalms are never used in liturgies because they contain cursing. Do you think this text vindictive or does it expresses a healthy "fear of the Lord"?






  • hilluminar
    Posts: 121
    I think it is fine. God is not only merciful; He is a just Judge as well. Sometimes the beginning of understanding is fear: "Strike them with terror..." in order that they might be saved. If they will not accept His ruling, they will certainly go down to the grave (hell). This psalm is only speaking the Truth. There are a few things in the psalms that do give me qualms though, and I am glad that we never have to chant them, like the end of psalm 137.
    Thanked by 1Ben
  • Kathy
    Posts: 5,509
    While the end of Psalm 137 isn't included in the post-Vatican II Liturgy of the Hours, these particular quoted verses are, so there shouldn't be a problem imho.
  • Andrew Motyka
    Posts: 946
    Also, understood properly, this psalm has an anagogical sense, too. "The wicked" refers primarily to the enemies of Israel and the Lord, but understood in a Christological context also refers to the devil and The Real Battle.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    four psalms are never used in liturgies because they contain cursing

    say what?
  • MarkThompson
    Posts: 768
    It would be more correct to say that they invoke curses. I think there are actually only three psalms omitted entirely from the LotH for this reason, nos. 58, 83, and 109, along with portions of others.
    Thanked by 3Adam Wood hilluminar Paul F. Ford
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