Let there be bongos
  • KARU27
    Posts: 184
    We have a new parish priest (ordained in 1971). He has been in our parish for 6 weeks. 2 weeks ago, we added in the strummy acoustic guitars. Then, last Sunday, the bongos and electric guitar made their appearance (I actually went to EF Mass that day, but my kids and husband told me about it).
    Is there anything I can say to the priest, that would be effective in getting him to stop this madness? Or the music director? I don't want my children to think this is normal. My 3 children attend the parish school, and the church is very close (within walking distance). I would go to EF all the time, except I think we are supposed to attend Mass where the kids go to school.
    Any thoughts on what might be effective? The music we used to have (for the past 6 years) was mainly organ, a little piano, a pretty small choir. Not an outstanding music program, but not offensive or embarrassing.

  • irishtenoririshtenor
    Posts: 1,296
    Make a respectful ruckus and make your views known to the music director and the priest. If you don't want your children exposed to that banal music, don't take them there for Mass. You are under absolutely no obligation to attend Mass at the parish where your children attend school. Make sure they know why you aren't going there anymore; use this as an opportunity for catechesis.
  • Go to another parish. I would not explain this to the children until they are of age and ready to make their own decisions. You really do not want them telling the world what you think of the music at mass at the parish. Silence is golden. Be shiny.

    Your bishop knew the musical leanings of your pastor, the bishop assigned him to your parish and you are royally (or episcopally) screwed as a result. There is nothing that you can do or say that will have any effect except make you look bad to people who can and will pounce and gossip.

    When people ask why you are going to Mass at the different church just say, "You know, I just feel more comfortable going to Mass there." and put your hands in the prayer position and look to the heavens. Avoid saying anything...it will all be used against you.

    Whenever you have the chance, let the air out of your bishop's tires on his cadillac. Put a flyer under the windshield wiper stating that: There are not enough guitars and bongos at Mass and we are going to keep doing this until EVERY MASS has guitars and bongos.

    Hmmm....he'll begin to hate guitars and bongos....THIS COULD WORK!

    PS: Caution, if he's driving an old, used white Fiat, his boss might be visiting.

  • melofluentmelofluent
    Posts: 4,160
    Noel, the Boss got a 30 year old Renault. Should've been a Citroen.
  • Agreed that you do not have to go to the parish where your children attend school. Maybe retain a connection to daily mass so the OF doesn't become foreign to them.

    The tough thing is not letting kids get scandalized or worse, arrogant, that they attend a more reverent mass. I know this first hand. "Honey, people, good people, are confused right now. God has left us in charge of what's best for you, and we think this is it. We'll let you know more as you get older..." does go a certain way, at least it has for my kids.

    Prayers for your situation. Your kids have one shot at a Catholic upbringing, and tough choices need to be made. You are the parents, and God will give you the grace to make good decisions.

    How I wish I could convince some (not all!!) Boomers and fellow trendy liturgical travelers that young people do not want hipster music. Especially hipster music that hasn't been hip for a long time. Sigh. I feel your pain.

    I was that Catholic school girl who repeatedly thought, "if Jesus is really on that altar, then why are we so casual about it?" I graduated 8th grade in 1987. No more than a handful of my 38 classmates retain a Catholic identity. To be honest, we weren't given much of one to begin with. I hope your children are getting better than what we had.

    Sorry for the length, and sorry if I sound too down on this. Just hits a sad nerve for me.
  • KARU27
    Posts: 184
    Thank you all for your advice. I definitely feel better about the fact that I am not obligated to attend Sunday Mass there. Our former pastor was very conservative in many ways, and shaped the parish that way. I suspect that I'm not the only one who feels upset about the change in liturgical style. We still have male altar servers (not for long though probably), and for a while we even had EF Mass at school, although that disappeared after a couple of months.
    Thank you all again for your sympathy and advice!
    Thanked by 2canadash CHGiffen
  • JulieCollJulieColl
    Posts: 2,465
    Been there, too, KARU! Sometimes you have to vote with your feet and walk away from a situation which you believe will be harmful to your children. We had to do the same thing at our local parish, and it was very painful.

    I think women more than men tend to put down deep roots in a parish or a school because they have an instinct to make their environments as home-like as possible, so it's difficult to leave when things change and/or otherwise become intolerable for one reason or another and there's nothing you can reasonably do to improve things.

    The upside is, at least with us, that we ended up at the Latin Mass in another diocese and became involved with the music. Now our kids get to sing Gregorian chant and polyphony every Sunday, and we have made many dear friends besides. The transplanting process wasn't easy, but eventually we've all blossomed.
    Thanked by 2KARU27 CHGiffen
  • jpal
    Posts: 365
    My family at first went to the parish attached to my Catholic school, but after a few years switched to a neighboring parish. They were not particularly "traditional" Catholics, but they sensed something wasn't right about the "children's liturgy" (taking kids away from their families during the most important part of Mass), the bland music, somewhat watered-down theology, etc.

    We joined the other parish when I was in second grade, and I became an altar boy and began serving at the weekly Latin OF Mass. Because of this, my experience of liturgical music in my formative years was rooted in Gregorian chant, polyphony, and sturdy (musically and theologically) hymns. Guess what I grew up liking? Gregorian chant, polyphony, and hymns. I went through an "experimental period" (parts of high school and college) where I sincerely tried contemporary/P&W because I had good friends who swore by it. In the end, nothing could stand up to what I experienced growing up. I am also recently beginning to appreciate the didactic value of having been raised singing solid hymns.

    My parents explained to us frankly but respectfully why we switched parishes. I didn't mind; I thought Latin and solemn liturgy were pretty cool (my younger brother, at four years old, could recite in Latin large swaths of the Roman Canon). But had they not switched us, I would be a completely different kind of music director now.

    If it weren't for us kids, my parents probably would have stayed and done their best to help the parish become better. When you have to think about the liturgical and theological formation of your children, it's a different matter.
  • JulieCollJulieColl
    Posts: 2,465
    I've seen the same transformation with my children, jpal. They took to the traditional Latin Mass like ducks to water, and for that I'm very thankful. Besides the tremendous spiritual benefits, it is a school of culture and aesthetics. The graciousness and courtesy of the rite, the other-worldly music, the silence and the reverence are all essential lessons for anyone attending it. The Roman rite, is after all, the defining force that created Catholic Europe.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    I think folks get too attached to places and don't leave when things go sour. Then they are, of course, unhappy with the changes. It's a big Church. No one should ever feel guilty about going somewhere else when conditions get bad in the home parish.
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    Yes, and that cuts bothe ways:

    If you don't like that "your" parish is introducing chant, polyphony, etc., than there are MANY other parishes with guitars, &c. to chose from.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,451
    By the way-
    Have you:
    -joined the choir?
    -volunteered to serve on anything like a liturgy committee?
    -voiced your concerns to the priest?
    -formed a "garage schola"?

    I don't mean to be accusatory, because I don't know if you have done any of those things, but- you might want to consider some or all of them before abandoning ship.

    The following is very much my own opinion:

    Some people are called to "stay and work" in parishes, communities, etc where something wrong is going on, where change can be effected.

    Some people are called to "leave and pray," moving to other parishes or communities where they can look after their own sanity and spiritual needs.

    And most people, I imagine, are called at different times in their life to do more one or the other- particularly, I would think, when children are a factor, and one must consider the environment they are to be raised and formed in.

    We should, none of us, judge anyone else for their decision to do one or other.

    We also, each of us, should take very seriously the discernment of which path is the right one for ourselves and for our families. God often calls us to work and to places which seem to us not to be our natural inclination: it may be that many "fighters" are called away to prayer, while many "prayers" are called onward to the fight.
  • ryandryand
    Posts: 1,640
    Adam is spot on.

    More than anything, you should voice your views (charitably, though firmly) to the priest and/or DM. The bongoists, when removed from other parishes, do not leave without complaining with gnashing teeth causing bleeding of ears.

    Whatever your decision ... to attend another mass, to attend another parish, to stay at your current parish, to join the choir, to sit in the pews and pray that the bongos catch fire ... at least let your opinion be heard by the higher-ups. There is nothing more effective you can do.
    Thanked by 1KARU27
  • JulieCollJulieColl
    Posts: 2,465
    God often calls us to work and to places which seem to us not to be our natural inclination: it may be that many "fighters" are called away to prayer, while many "prayers" are called onward to the fight.


    Insightful words, Adam. Thank you. I've been pondering this theme for a while. While you must always pray in every circumstance, it's not always easy to determine whether you should push the "fight" button or the "flight" button, and my mixed heritage doesn't help. I suspect my Scottish-German side prefers the former, while my French-Irish prefers the latter---or something like that.
    Thanked by 1KARU27
  • melofluentmelofluent
    Posts: 4,160
    We have a new parish priest (ordained in 1971). He has been in our parish for 6 weeks. 2 weeks ago, we added in the strummy acoustic guitars. Then, last Sunday, the bongos and electric guitar made their appearance

    Here, there and everywhere in litboards we've all joked about the ubiquitous "Liturgy Police." With this new report it strikes a particularly sour chord within me because these clerical princes of my generation have steadfastly refused to admit their privatization, misappropriation and autocracies by the rationale (not virtue) of alter Christus enables them to inflict indignity upon indignity upon the rites. Whether by shiny happy talk show host-like demeanors, grandiose pomposity, or "Jesus is our best friend, and so am I," they hold the faithful hostage by enabling their dependency upon authority to tell them "it's gonna all turn out allright." Enough.
    I can, thankfully say that this situation does not involve priests of that age in our parishes, and our senior retired priest is an amazing liturgist!
    But, when I hear these stories as by KARU, I wish for the formation of a Liturgy Posse Comitatus (sp?) formed by geezers like me, Noel, Chuck, CharlesW who would be a mobile circuit court with the no-nonsense attitude of Judge Judy, the been-there-done-that demeanor of Teddy Roosevelt, the wisdom of Sheen/Rutler/Barron combined, and the clout of Vlad Putin. Oh, and did I mention the resolve of Vito Corleone?
    It isn't about the bongos and guitars, never has been. It's about the lethal combination of the omnipresent and co-dependent clericalism and the insidious effects of license disguised as liberation that has created a "Wonderland" of self-indulgency and what I hope HHF meant as a the self-satisfaction of triumphalism that has nothing to do with the Passion, death and Resurrection of Christ (on the Cross.)
    I wish I could transport this SWAT team into the dens of such clerics like Star Trek's Scotty, and just inform these men to cut the crap, the nonsense and wise up NOW. They don't know the smell of the sheep, only that of petulie oil and country club greens. They know how to mess things up, but not in the way Francis means. They know what the Black and the Red is, but they don't care! And I wonder if they sing themselves to sleep with "You've got a friend" rather than "Salve Regina" at bedtime.
    That's my biological solution. Redeem these men from their errors.
    End of rant.
  • And now for something completely different...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPkrin2g-7E
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,451
    Oh, and did I mention the resolve of Vito Corleone?

    I can just imagine priests waking up to find the heads of their bongo drums have been ripped off and placed beside them in bed.
    Thanked by 2KARU27 Richard Mix
  • JulieCollJulieColl
    Posts: 2,465
    Bravo, MF. It's time for a sheep-uprising.

    image
  • marajoymarajoy
    Posts: 781
    I think it becomes a tougher situation when children are involved... While in a perfect world we could all stay at our geographic parishes and help to make things better, when you are entrusted with the responsibility of raising children, I think the salvation of their souls and teaching them (through experience) about "good" liturgy becomes more important than trying to make changes in a place that is not interested.
  • JulieCollJulieColl
    Posts: 2,465
    Just as an aside, speaking of Vito Corleone, a bunch of outlaws were buried from the cemetery chapel where we have our diocesan Latin Mass every Sunday in Queens: John Gotti, Lucky Luciano, Carlo Gambino, and a host of mafia thugs. They could not be buried from a parish church so the chapel was used for their funerals. I believe that is one of the reasons our beautiful old chapel could not be razed since it's a historical landmark because of its connection with mob bosses.

    Go figure. There's some real irony in there somewhere, considering the fact that many of us who attend are liturgical exiles from other dioceses.
  • tomjaw
    Posts: 2,704
    And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words: going forth out of that house or city shake off the dust from your feet. Matt 10, 14
    Thanked by 3CharlesW marajoy Gavin