Communion and Post Communion Songs
  • henry
    Posts: 241
    I seem to remember reading somewhere that if a Communion song is sung, there should not be a Post Communion Song and vice versa. Am I remembering correctly, and if so is that documented anywhere? Thanks.
  • See paragraphs 86-88 of the GIRM.

    Some celebrations are entirely without singing.
    But if it's a celebration with singing, there should be a Communion song (that is, sung during the Communion reception). And there can be a “hymn after Communion” as well.

    So in answer to your question, the only thing excluded is to have a post-Communion hymn but nothing sung during Communion.

    (The question of who sings, choir or soloist or the faithful as a whole, is a different question.)
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,945
    And, per No. 86 of the GIRM, the Communion song begins *while* the celebrant receives Communion, not after.
  • davido
    Posts: 874
    ^ The GIRM frequently says dumb things.
  • a_f_hawkins
    Posts: 3,372
    GIRM§88 says a period of sacred silence must be observed after communion. See also §45, §146. If you have both a Communion chant and a postcommunion hymn of praise "the singing during communion must be ended in a timely manner", I take this to suggest silence is observed during the purification.
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,945
    "The GIRM frequently says dumb things."

    Except this is not one of those. The requirement underscores the unity of the Communion rite. It also, according to someone here years ago, reflects a requirement for the Communio in the ritual books for the preconciliar solemn high Mass.
  • Singing the communio as the celebrant receives is a good, solid practice. Necessarily starting a communion hymn at that point seems a bit odd though.
    Thanked by 1Andrew_Malton
  • “Seems a bit odd”, yes, it is odd, but in fact no less required. If it seems odd that's because hymns are odd as replacements for the proper ritual text and music. An oddness which is found elsewhere, too.
  • What is the current position on a "Meditation" piece sung by the choir alone after Communion. I am being instructed that "we sing a meditation song in this parish" and I must do it.
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,945
    The current "position" is:

    86. While the Priest is receiving the Sacrament, the Communion Chant is begun, its purpose being to express the spiritual union of the communicants by means of the unity of their voices, to show gladness of heart, and to bring out more clearly the “communitarian” character of the procession to receive the Eucharist. The singing is prolonged for as long as the Sacrament is being administered to the faithful. (cf. Inestimabile Donum 17) However, if there is to be a hymn after Communion [cf. no. 88 below], the Communion Chant should be ended in a timely manner.

    Care should be taken that singers, too, can receive Communion with ease.

    87. In the Dioceses of the United States of America, there are four options for singing at Communion: (1) the antiphon from the Missal or the antiphon with its Psalm from the Graduale Romanum, as set to music there or in another musical setting; (2) the antiphon with Psalm from the Graduale Simplex of the liturgical time; (3) a chant from another collection of Psalms and antiphons, approved by the Conference of Bishops or the Diocesan Bishop, including Psalms arranged in responsorial or metrical forms; (4) some other suitable liturgical chant (cf. no. 86 [above]) approved by the Conference of Bishops or the Diocesan Bishop. This is sung either by the choir alone or by the choir or a cantor with the people.

    However, if there is no singing, the antiphon given in the Missal may be recited either by the faithful, or by some of them, or by a reader; otherwise, it is recited by the Priest himself after he has received Communion and before he distributes Communion to the faithful.

    88. When the distribution of Communion is over, if appropriate, the Priest and faithful pray quietly for some time. If desired, a Psalm or other canticle of praise or a hymn may also be sung by the whole congregation.
  • Richard MixRichard Mix
    Posts: 2,768
    88. When the distribution of Communion is over, if appropriate, the Priest and faithful pray quietly for some time. If desired, a Psalm or other canticle of praise or a hymn may also be sung by the whole congregation.

    Pace a_f_hawkins, I don't read this as 'sacred silence' but as private prayer while the Communion antiphon finishes or until the "whole congregation" is ready to begin their own 'psalm': our rule of thumb is that they all be back within reach of a hymnal.

    The Lutheran liturgy provides for an optional post-communion hymn (usually Nunc dimittis) after a table blessing prayer but before the Collect.
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,945
    45. Sacred silence also, as part of the celebration, is to be observed at the designated times.[Sacrosanctum Concilium 30; Musicam Sacram 17] Its nature, however, depends on the moment when it occurs in the different parts of the celebration. For in the Penitential Act and again after the invitation to pray, individuals recollect themselves; whereas after a reading or after the Homily, all meditate briefly on what they have heard; *then after Communion*, they praise God in their hearts and pray to him.

    Even before the celebration itself, it is a praiseworthy practice for silence to be observed in the church, in the sacristy, in the vesting room, and in adjacent areas, so that all may dispose themselves to carry out the sacred celebration in a devout and fitting manner.

    [emphasis added]

    * * *

    The GIRM does not have one-stop shopping, topically.
    Thanked by 1a_f_hawkins
  • a_f_hawkins
    Posts: 3,372
    The point about GIRM calling it "sacred silence" is to emphasise that is a "thing", an action, in its own right. And a collective action as GIRM45 says, not just waiting for somebody to finish.
  • Richard MixRichard Mix
    Posts: 2,768
    Of course, Liam. Maybe I should have drawn a distinction between "sacred silence" as mentioned for example in GIRM 43 and my single scarequotes 'sacred silence', which I suppose some literalists might concede is satisfied by the pause between the two pieces of music.

    When he visited an anechoic chamber where his pulse and nervous system were very much foregrounded, John Cage wondered whether there was such a thing as silence. He adopted a working definition of "the absence of intentional sounds". If we do the same, the question then becomes whose intention: is it a requirement that after returning from Communion one wait for the schola to finish before they "praise God in their hearts and pray to him"? For now I'm going to remain skeptical about that, perhaps because I'm just as likely to be distracted by IDing the birdsong outside the stained glass as by my usual pleasure in music.
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • One thing that I think people need to embrace more of is silence. The music director at my home parish and I agree on a lot, but she believes we always need two Communion hymns to cover the entirety. I believe we should have a period of silence after Communion, but looking at other churches via livestream, I seem to be in the minority on that.
  • The practice at the parish which employs me is as follows:
    1. The proper is sung as the priest receives
    2. Organ interlude/improv as the choir and people receive
    3. Congregational chanting of a psalm to a psalm tone during the ablutions

    Does a strict reading of the GIRM prohibit this? It seems like it would. Does a strict reading of the GIRM preclude having the choir sing a motet during communion? What about the proper and then a hymn? The wording doesn't seem to account for the many musical possibilities that communion down-time presents.
    Thanked by 2hilluminar tomjaw
  • At our (NO) "Low" Masses, the practice at communion is as follows:
    1. Antiphon by cantor as the Priest consumes with verses until the verses are depleted.
    2. Hymn sung by the congregation (ALWAYS Eucharistic in Nature - one would think this is given, but I've learned it's not.)
    3. Short organ improvisation in a quiet manner or silence (or both)

    At our Choral "High" Masses:
    1. Antiphon by schola as the Priest consumes with verses until they are depleted.
    2. Organ Improvisation while the choir receives.
    3. Motet/Anthem (Eucharistic in Nature) OR a hymn (if the Motet/Anthem was sung at the offertory.
    4. Hymn (only if absolutely needed) OR quiet improvisation/silence depending on how many communicants are present.
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,945
    "Hymn sung by the congregation (ALWAYS Eucharistic in Nature - one would think this is given, but I've learned it's not.)"

    So long as "Eucharistic in Nature" includes psalms of praise and gratitude for God's feeding of and care for us (Ps 34, 78, 145, et cet. - consider the sources for the Communion Propers), and scriptural canticles like the Magnificat, then I understand it being "given". If it more or less means benediction/adoration hymns, then that's too restrictive to be "given" IMO.
  • Can one be too restrictive in the language of our Eucharistic hymns, or be too restrictive in using only hymns that speak properly of our Eucharistic Lord in His True Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity? In a world where so many say they are Catholic but don't believe in the true, Transubstantiated Presence of our Lord, I don't think one can be too restrictive...

    That said, I agree with you @Liam.
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    I had the choir sing the English "communio" for the day while the priest received then shifted into a subdued organ piece while the choir received. The choir stayed in the loft and did not process downstairs but couldn't seem to keep singing and receiving together at the same time. When they were back in their seats I began the communion hymn.
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,160
    The antiphons which the Church provides for us to sing at Communion often do not contain a reference to the Sacrament, so I wouldn't be strict about the hymn text.