Cardinal Sarah's Talk
  • Kathy
    Posts: 5,500
    Coming soon!
    Thanked by 3GerardH jczarn eft94530
  • jczarn
    Posts: 65
    I was just reading about his talk in this article:
    https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/vatican-liturgy-chief-asks-all-priests-and-bishops-to-face-east-for-mass-fa

    Is this really "the biggest liturgical announcement since Benedict XVI’s 2007 motu proprio Summorum Pontificum"? It is wonderful to hear this, but I'm wondering if it will taken seriously by the vast majority of bishops/priests.
    Thanked by 1LenaH
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,960
    "It is wonderful to hear this, but I'm wondering if it will taken seriously by the vast majority of bishops/priests."

    Probably not. Most priests won't hear of it unless they get a missive from the diocesan office of worship (most parish priests are too busy to be following Catholic liturgy blogs and discussion boards and related social media). I imagine a select few bishops (the ones who already adopt this orientation) may try to legislate it, but otherwise, no.
  • What could make a difference would be telling far and wide the simple fact that the historical basis for what most seminarians have been taught for decades now—i.e., that “versus populum” is a restoration of widespread ancient practice—is, in fact, so much straw.
    Thanked by 1eft94530
  • eft94530eft94530
    Posts: 1,577
    Horrors.
    I am against it.
    What will happen to the economy when fewer floral sprays
    are purchased for the front of the altar?

    Oh.
    The one spray will be replaced with two for the corners,
    and the price with be 60%+60%.
    Never mind.
    Carry on.

    Purple Bold OFF.
    Thanked by 1CharlesW
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,939
    Face the east, kneel for communion? What will happen to all the old bags in pantsuits distributing communion, or the cast of thousands surrounding the altar, or the newly homeless deacons and other hangers-on? Think of the unemployed banner makers. Oh, the horror. Oh, the humanity.

    All kidding aside, I have said many times the Cardinal would make a good pope!
  • VilyanorVilyanor
    Posts: 388
    I went to my childhood parish last Sunday because I was unable to get up in time for a Liturgical Mass. There were no fewer than 13 EMHCs. Some were joking and laughing during the Agnus Dei. It was physically painful to see.
  • Vilyanor,

    What conclusion do you draw from what you saw?
  • VilyanorVilyanor
    Posts: 388
    I'm not sure there's necessarily a conclusion, but basically that the vast majority of parishes in the united states are utterly liturgically hopeless, and vast church-wide reforms are necessary, so Sarah might be heading us in the right direction. Heck, if he and certain others can be the main writers of an encyclical with corresponding amendments of Church law and practice under Francis, it would probably be a good thing because anything with Francis's name on it is too big too ignore.
  • VilyanorVilyanor
    Posts: 388
    That's actually perhaps a bonus of Francis' absurd popularity in the media—it's trickling down to Sarah it would seem.
  • Ted
    Posts: 202
    Most are now familiar with the rebukes Cardinal Sarah has received in the past 24 hours from the likes of Fr. Lombardi of the Vatican press office, and Cardinal Nichols in whose diocese the Sacra Liturgia conference took place.
    It would seem there are statements being made that condradict what Cardional Sarah said. To help clarify this, here is a link that Fr Mark Kirby posted of the complete text with pdf download option of Cardinal Sarah's address.

    http://vultuschristi.org/index.php/2016/07/sacra-liturgia-releases-official-text/
    Thanked by 1JulieColl
  • Kathy
    Posts: 5,500
    The last time the Church was forbidden to talk about something was in 1994, and that was in the form of an apostolic letter, not a press communique.

    Just sayin'...
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,939
    I think the good cardinal knew exactly what he was saying. Further, I find him more clear-headed and consistent than some of his "interpreters."
    Thanked by 2JulieColl CCooze
  • JulieCollJulieColl
    Posts: 2,465
    More bon mots from Cardinal Sarah's momentous address:

    1) For many years before the Council, in missionary countries and also in the more developed ones, there had been much discussion about the possibility of increasing the use of the vernacular languages in the liturgy, principally for the readings from Sacred Scripture, also for some of the other parts of the first part of the Mass (which we now call the “Liturgy of the Word”) and for liturgical singing. The Holy See had already given many permissions for the use of the vernacular in the administration of the sacraments. This is the context in which the Fathers of the Council spoke of the possible positive ecumenical or missionary effects of liturgical reform. It is true that the vernacular has a positive place in the liturgy. The Fathers were seeking this, not authorising the protestantization of the Sacred Liturgy or agreeing to it being subjected to a false inculturation.

    2) The Fathers did not intend a revolution, but an evolution, a moderate reform.

    3) At the beginning of article 21 we also hear the Fathers’ intentions very clearly: “In order that the Christian people may more certainly derive an abundance of graces from the Sacred Liturgy, holy Mother Church desires to undertake with great care a general restoration of the liturgy itself.” “Ut populus christianus in sacra Liturgia abundantiam gratiarum securius assequatur...” When we study Latin we learn that the word “ut” signifies a clear purpose that follows in the same clause. What did the Council Fathers intend? —that the Christian people may more certainly derive an abundance of graces from the Sacred Liturgy. How did they propose to do this? —by undertaking with great care a general restoration of the liturgy itself (“ipsius Liturgiae generalem instaurationem sedulo curare cupit”). Please note that the Fathers speak of a “restoration,” not a revolution!

    3) My brothers and sisters, where are the faithful of whom the Council Fathers spoke? Many of the faithful are now unfaithful: they do not come to the liturgy at all.

    4) No bishop, priest or deacon vested for liturgical ministry or present in the sanctuary should be taking photographs, even at large-scale concelebrated Masses. That priests sadly often do this at such Masses, or talk with each other and sit casually, is a sign, I think, that we need urgently to rethink the appropriateness of these immense concelebrations, especially if they lead priests into this sort of scandalous behaviour that is so unworthy of the mystery being celebrated.

    5) It is sadly true that in the decades since the Second Vatican Council, “alongside [the] lights, there are also shadows” in the Church’s liturgical life, as Saint John Paul II said in Ecclesia de Eucharistia (n.10). And it is our duty to address the causes of this. But it is a source of great hope and joy that today, as the twenty-first century proceeds, many faithful Catholics are convinced of the importance of the liturgy in the life of the Church and dedicate themselves to the liturgical apostolate, to what may be broadly called a new liturgical movement.