Tallis' "O Nata Lux" - a question for experts on interpreting early music.
  • Hugh
    Posts: 198
    Yesterday while conducting the Tallis "O Nata Lux" at Mass, I began to wonder about the way it's presented in modern editions.

    As A shows below (from "Cantiones Sacrae" 1575) there is no barring in the original published editions from the 16th c., so any modern edition that doesn't reflect this involves to some extent a bit of eisegesis. Nothing wrong with that, but why do all modern editions go with B (below) and not C (a version I've knocked up just for this post). Why, that is, do modern editions unanimously elect not have an upbeat intro. bar, and follow that through? Is there some rule or subtle interplay that C suppresses? C seems to me (for all its limitations) to make the verbal rhythms much easier to understand. Note that all hymnals present Tallis' Canon (e.g. "Glory to thee my God this night") with an intro upbeat bar, & it has a v. similar meter.

    Some editions - e.g. Chester, set it in 3/4, not 6/4. Granted, an upbeat there would result in a lot of ties across bar lines and end up looking v. messy, making for more confusion rather than less. However, as it is, it still threatens to impose a false stress on the text: "O na-ta LUX 2,3, DE lu-mi-NE,2.." etc, rather than "o NA-ta lux, 4, 5, de LU-mi-ne,4..." e.t.c., which means you might have to give a big heads up at the outset to inexperienced choristers about defending verbal accents, e.t.c., against the modern barring.

    I have no formal music training whatsoever, and this is probably all explained in a 101 class, but I'd still be grateful for instruction on this, even if it exposes my massive ignorance.

    Thanked by 1Heath
  • You raise an interesting question. True, there are some stresses which seem out of place in the example you have given; but, there are some that are out of place in your own attempt at rectification. Indeed, there seem to be pluses and minuses to each version. In my opinion, and with all due deference to you, the published example that you have provided flows, on the whole, more fluently than yours. This is a matter that usually needs to be addressed by carefully singing the text with primacy given to word and syntactic rhythm. We must, as you wisely point out, be always careful in this music not to be obsessed with metre. Recite the text before singing it, and sing it closely to how you recite it. Such a procedure is often as helpful to metrical music as it is essential to chant.
  • Hugh
    Posts: 198
    Hey, thanks for this v. informative reply, MJO. My rule of thumb is always to go with whatever the group finds easiest to interpret properly, so if B (above) has a better flow, then that's the one to go with. I'm too close to be able to tell, having mulled over this the last day or so. I'll come back to it after a break - say around August 6 (Transfiguration) time and look at them anew side by side.

    I agree re. pluses and minuses each version. Just eyeballing, (sop. line only) re. accents and the first beat of the bar, the Chester (3/4) edition hits about 8/30 bars, the published version (B above) hits about 3 or 4 out of 16, and my C adjusted attempt hits about 12/18. But there's more to it all than that, I know, and the big thing is not to be obsessed with the modern meter, as you put it well. (Good tip re. recitation, btw.)

    In fact, singing through the Cantiones Sacrae barline-free version gave me a refreshing new perspective on the whole piece. I'm thinking of publishing it for my choir to sing, just to liberate us all a bit from too much bar-fixation.

    Cheers.
  • BruceL
    Posts: 1,072
    C wants to fit the rhythmic/metric scheme for the whole piece into the first accent. I feel the first big accent on "lux" with my choir, while pointing out that "nata" needs plenty of text accent. One of the charming parts of this score is that there is a real duple/triple dialogue (e.g., contratenor on the text "quondam contegi" and so on).

    This quasi mensural edition (http://www2.cpdl.org/wiki/images/9/94/Tallis_ONata.pdf) is a better score to read from, but I use your "B" above just because it includes the translation. For my singers, that is more important than the rhythmic implications of the meter: after all, I just want them to sing the stresses I give them! :)

    We sing the mensural one I linked above with a professional Renaissance group I sing with, and all of us (who are in the group precisely because we love Tudor polyphony) appreciate its less overbearing nature! That said, it's a much different type/quality of singer.
    Thanked by 3Hugh Heath CHGiffen
  • CGM
    Posts: 683
    My own recommendation is a pickup bar of three quarters, with the score in 3/2 time. [See my edition, here.]
  • Quite nicely done, CGM.
    Thanked by 1CGM
  • CGM
    Posts: 683
    I think that the 3/2 time (with the three-quarter-note pickup bar) conveys a clear sense of Tallis's harmonic motion. Downbeats line up with cadences. The arrival-points are visually clear. This solution came from my original source, of provenance now lost to the mists of time. (I was just trying to make a score which would have no page turns!)
  • CGM
    Posts: 683
    This year I made a reduced scoring for four voices, which I think mostly succeeds. All the biting cross-relations are intact. At the end, when one of the tenor voices is moved to the alto part, a little power is lost due to the shift in tessitura, and the reconstituted tenor line requires considerable effort. That being said, if you've only got one tenor, this arrangement may suffice.
  • Hugh
    Posts: 198
    That's great CGM - the 3-quarter note pickup bar shunts the whole piece into the right rhythmical frame, something I was hoping to do with C, but didn't really achieve. And because it's just a pickup bar, the opening "O" doesn't demand to be unduly emphasised. Thank you. I'm knicking that, and maybe incorporating that quasi-mensural idea of Brucel (ta) above to get those bars even further into the background. 4 part arr. is also v. useful with my situation, too.

    Wow, I've benefited greatly from this venture. Thanks to all & God bless for the rest of Lent.
  • BruceL
    Posts: 1,072
    CGM, that is a wonderful edition. How do you keep singers from going too strongly to "lux", neglecting "nata"? While I like the three grouping after the rests in the phrases, it does (to me) shape the character strongly into a metrical framework. That's one of the things I struggle with in this piece...the dialogue of text and harmonic rhythm.
  • rich_enough
    Posts: 1,032
    Here is another arrangement of "O nata lux" for SATB, in the interest of comparison with Chris Muller's version.
    Thanked by 1Heath
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,148
    Let's get the tempo markings straightened out, in accord with what Tallis actually put in his score (and clearly intended, once you understand what is there):

    The "C with a dot in the middle" signifies "tempus imperfectum, prolatio maior" – which means what? Well, the C means that the overall rhythmic pattern (albeit perhaps quite slow) is in two semibreves, dotted because the dot in the middle of the C means that the two-beat patterns is to be regarded as subdivided into three minims. The modern way of notating the time signature for Tallis's score (without changing note values) is 6/2. With the note values halved, it would be 6/4. In no way whatsoever should the time signature with note values halved be given as 3/2, which implies "tempus perfectum, prolatio minor" or an overall beat pattern of three beats (minims) with subdivision into two crotchets. With the original note values of Tallis's score, if he wanted to indicate an overall pattern of three semibreves subdivided into two minims, he would have used a "circle" (with no dot in the middle).

    David Fraser's 6/2 score (from CPDL) is, in fact, a correct rendering in modern notation, by an acknowledged Byrd-Tallis scholar. Halving note values would render the score in 6/4, and to label such a score as 3/2 misses the overall rhythmic structure of the piece. And to render it as 3/2 (or even 6/4) with a 3 crotchet pickup puts undue stress on "lux" and other similarly positioned syllables. The overarching stress pattern is not on every minim (or every second crotchet, although in isolated individual voices there are some instances of "hemiola" patterns (exercise: find them).
  • Heath
    Posts: 933
    What a great thread!

    Also wanted to point out another edition that bumps it up a step (a minor) and re-works one super-low note in the middle part so it could be sung by another alto instead of a tenor. We normally do this version since I have great altos and few tenors:

    http://www.tvjrdean.f9.co.uk/music/choral/o nata lux a minor.pdf
  • Heath
    Posts: 933
    Bumping with Lent 2 coming up!

    Another four-voice version I found to throw into the mix (with a singing English translation, to boot) . . . this one also has an extra "crunch" between the soprano and tenor in m. 6. I've never seen this one before....hmm.

    http://folio.furman.edu/projects/anthems/pdf/O_Light_from_Light.pdf
    Thanked by 1janetgorbitz
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,148
    Tallis explicitly notates the Superius (Soprano) with one flat (not two, as in the other parts). And, as the Superius part posted above shows with an explicit "x" in the score, the E on "re-DEMP-tor"/"re-DEEM-er" is indeed supposed to be an E-natural, not E-flat as Backwell has (to my mind) erroneously inserted, creating the "crunch" that Heath mentions. Check the (authentic) David Fraser edition (on CPDL) for the correct rendering.