I hope I'm not gullible, but...
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    I just spoke with a priest who said that there were new directives out that say the organ CAN be used during Lent. I hope that he is wrong, or just misreading something from the Diocese, and presuming that since the organ can be used on Solemnities, and Sundays are Solemnities, &c., &c. But in this day and age, what with Rabbitgate, and Synodgate, and all the rest, a breach with liturgical tradition like this is, to me, completely plausible.

    Tra le, Musicam Sacram, GIRM, and tradition are all in agreement about the supression of organ music (except to accompany the singing).
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    It was that damned Paulist Ordo for the Province. It gives the rubric, and then negates it with a bunch of 'Pastoral' gobledy-gook, about the "Spirit of Lent".

    I mean it's not ass if the Paulists are still Catholic.
    Thanked by 1Daniel Bennett Page
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    So take it under advisement and study the issue, changing nothing until your research is complete. You can probably reach a conclusion by the end of Holy Week.

    I mean it's not ass if the Paulists are still Catholic.


    Not a typo if you are writing about some in that order. I have known some orthodox Paulists, but had one recently tell me Eucharistic Prayer I is open to so much misinterpretation, he doesn't use it to keep from confusing the people.
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    LOL.

    I follow GIRM & Musicam Sacram: No preludes-postludes-interludes except Laetare Sunday, Annunciation, and St. Joseph.

    Organ music is one area where you Byzantines have it so much easier than we Latins!
    Thanked by 2CharlesW Daniel Bennett Page
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    Organ music is one area where you Byzantines have it so much easier than we Latins!


    True, but as a DM and organist in a Latin parish, I feel your pain. ;-)
  • ClergetKubiszClergetKubisz
    Posts: 1,912
    My understanding is the same as yours: no solo organ during Lent or Advent. Period. It can be used to accompany singing, but for no other purpose during liturgies, or perhaps someone can correct me if I'm wrong on that: perhaps it just applies to Mass, but I thought it applied to other liturgies as well, such as Stations of the Cross.
  • matthewjmatthewj
    Posts: 2,694
    Stations of the Cross is not a liturgy. It is a devotion. It can certainly have solo organ music.
  • M. Jackson Osborn
    Posts: 8,368
    'Stations of the Cross is not a liturgy....[therefore] it can... have...organ music.

    Isn't this rather like saying that Sundays are in Lent and not of Lent, therefore I can feast on those Sundays as though it were Easter Day? There are some 'spirits of' that commend themselves.

    And, because Stations follows a prescribed and very public ritual, one might question that 'it is not a liturgy'. (One might.)
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,605
    Giving up playing organ solos during Lent is better than giving up....chocolate!

    It's not that we are not allowed to play during Lent, it's that we are allowed to play the rest of the year.
    Thanked by 1hilluminar
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    Dark chocolate is an acceptable eastern fasting food, since it doesn't contain dairy. ;-) I can have it during Lent with no problems whatever.

    I kind of like the contrast with the rest of the year by not playing except to accompany singing during Lent. It gets across the message that this time is different. During Advent, which has no rules against playing, I drop preludes and postludes and keep what I do play in the spirit of the season. Otherwise, Advent turns into the pre-Christmas festival.
    Thanked by 2M. Jackson Osborn musiclover88
  • eft94530eft94530
    Posts: 1,577
    Dark chocolate is an acceptable eastern fasting food

    Was it Dark Chocolate in 15th century Russia?
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    Was it Dark Chocolate in 15th century Russia?


    I don't make the rules. As long as it contains no dairy, eggs, or meat, it is a fasting food.

    There is a recipe section of acceptable dishes on The Byzantine Forum. I believe the Greek Orthodox have some Lenten recipes posted on some of their sites, as well.

    Saints Lindt & Sprungli preserve and protect us. St. Ghirardelli intercede for us.
    Thanked by 1musiclover88
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,451
    Dark Chocolate has milk in it.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    Dark Chocolate has milk in it.


    The good stuff doesn't. I buy 99% cocoa and there is no milk in it. Precious little sugar, as well.
  • eft94530eft94530
    Posts: 1,577
    no dairy, eggs, or meat, it is a fasting food.

    Woohoo! Eastern church here I come.
    Sour gummy worms back on the menu!
    Purple bold of course.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    Stop and think about it. For most people, you take away dairy, meat, and eggs and you have removed most of the foods they like and want to eat. Granted, I am vegetarian so I don't care about meats. Dairy and eggs I miss. They are ingredients in many ordinary foods. It's a looong 40 or so days. It just adds to the rejoicing of Easter. Gummy worms? Now that would be penance! LOL.
  • SeasonPsaltSeasonPsalt
    Posts: 78
    Lent is Lent.

    93.8% of all people are gullible (with a 6.2% margin of error).

    There is nothing new under the sun.

    Getting upset about what other people may be doing during Lent isn't really within the spirit of Lent.

    This year is the first time ever I attended a large parish for Ash Wednesday. There was no instrumental music. But in the silence, six ministers speaking: "You are dust, and to dust you will return" echoing through the entire church otherwise in silence was very spiritual to me. It was as if the Church itself, or the cloud of witnesses, was speaking to all the parishioners.

    As far as organ playing - preludes and postludes were done in my small humble parish, at least for the first week of Lent. I attended another parish for the second. I think it had nothing to do with "asinine Paulists," or whatever, but rather with ignorance. The musicians were certainly making no statement by their actions. If they were, my priest would fire them on the spot. I mean, really. He's forgiving of ignorance but unforgiving of wilful disobedience to the Church.

    But if a priest agrees with the Paulists, that is between the Priest and the Bishop.

    I guess I'm saying, let the Paulists do what the Paulists do, unless it's your responsibility. I pray for the intercession of Thecla Merlo for a private intention frequently, maybe she will be sainted eventually.

    But do educate the rest. Somehow. Maybe not on this forum, where people seem to be conversant with the GIRM, but elsewhere. I suspect if my Parish musicians were aware of the prohibition they would keep the silence of Lent.

    And maybe USCCB will decide with the Paulists and update the GIRM?

    The Church is dynamic, not static. Frankly, I prefer the prohibition during Lent, but I will submit to the Church.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,157
    Just in case there's any confusion: Ven. Thecla Merlo was with the Paulines, founded in Italy by Bl. James Alberione; the Paulists are an unrelated society founded in the US by Isaac Hecker.
    Thanked by 1eft94530
  • SeasonPsaltSeasonPsalt
    Posts: 78
    As always- thank you for your correction, Chonak!

    I've learned more about liturgical music (and other some topics) from two weeks of lurking the threads here than I may have in a year of reading printed materials.

    It has given me a lot more respect for our Church's musicians!
    Thanked by 1bonniebede
  • gregpgregp
    Posts: 632
    SeasonPsalt - you'll learn a thousand times more if you come to the Colloquium this year!
    Thanked by 1Ben
  • SeasonPsaltSeasonPsalt
    Posts: 78
    gregp: Sooooo tempting. I really have to look at my vacation schedule. I mean, this really IS tempting. I'll be the guy in flame-retardant HRC2 rated clothing with FR suspenders and EH rated boots with metatarsal guards. You might not want to let me near your organ pedals!
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