Ordinariate Compline
  • Does anyone have a copy of Compline according to the Ordinariate's usage, with all of the Coverdale psalms notated in plainchant? Would be very grateful for a copy to use as a starting point for things here.
  • Ordinariate compline may be found at page 179 in The Book of Divine Worship (Newman Press), which, however, will in the near future be replaced by a new liturgical book common to all the ordinariates in the world. For a complete Coverdale psalter pointed for the Gregorian tones you may want to invest in St Dunstan's Plainsong Psalter, published by the Lancelot Andrewes Press, from whom it may be had. There is no other book to compare to this one, Coverdale or otherwise.

    I have yet to see a Catholic attempt at using the Gregorian tones for English psalmody that did not get the syllabification wrong, or in one way or another botch the tone by putting two syllables on what is supposed to be a podatus, or putting one syllable on two neumes that are supposed to have a syllable each, or some such amateurishness. Anglicans have been doing this for quite a long time and are much better at it. Get the St Dunstan's Plainsong Psalter.
  • ronkrisman
    Posts: 1,388
    MJO, it would be more instructive had you provided a few examples to support your position, rather than generalize that Catholics aren't good at using Gregorian tones for English psalmody.

    Gregorian psalm tones were created for Latin-language psalm texts, not for Hebrew, Greek, French or English texts. For one thing, Latin has few words (only some monosylabic ones) ending with a stressed syllable. English has tons of them, not all monosyllables (e.g., success, release, underfoot, overwhelm - random words found in the RGP translation). Latin also has but a very few words with accented syllables followed by two or more unaccented ones; English has lots of them (e.g., heavenly, iniquity, sanctuary). Those characteristics of English words alone may account for the general rules of pointing Latin texts for Gregorian tones not always working with English texts and, consequently, calling for some adapting of the rules.

    That being said, I would agree with you that some liberties taken with the pointing rules are unnecessary and hinder declamation of the psalm texts rather than help.
  • Thanks for your commentary, Father. I was remembering examples that I had happened to have seen over the years, but cannot, right now, offer specific ones. Although I did say 'I have yet to see...', perhaps I erred in overly generalising. Everything you say is, of course, true. It is, though, quite possible to sing English psalmody to the Gregorian tones without altering the tone or its implied syllabification. Too, one may observe that sometimes this results in an accented or unaccented syllable where, technically, it doesn't belong in a given psalm tone. When this happens, some artful locution and musicianship are required to produce a graceful result. One might, also, offer the general experience that the Coverdale psalter is rather easier to work with in this regard than many modern translations, this owing to its generally more graceful and less abrupt language.

    Actually, we should have for our use a revised Grail psalter set skillfully to the Gregorian tones. This would be a worthy companion to the St Dunstan's Plainsong Psalter, which is Coverdale's version. There is no reason at all why Catholics can't do this, and do it skillfully, it's just that they never seem to do so; it's always the Anglicans who seem to fill such voids.
  • rarty
    Posts: 96
    Well, since it is the Catholic tradition to sing the psalmody of the Office with antiphons of various modes... a simple psalter with all the psalms pointed or set to single tones is not as useful as I'm sure it is for the Anglican prayer-book services.

    The book referenced above is available online: The Book of Divine Worship.
    Thanked by 1ronkrisman
  • Um, these 'Anglican prayer-book services' are now quite Catholic masses and offices, in case you haven't heard. And, as to the matter of the antiphons, I see no universal problem to matching a psalm tone to its respective antiphonal mode... except that, admittedly, some of the more elaborate cadences do present problems in an English that is too abrupt and relatively colourless.

    And, psalmody has many uses and benefits other than as in its role in the divine office, in which it is graced with antiphons. Such unison singing is profitable both spiritually and musically at choir rehearsals and gatherings. (Indeed, a choir that cannot sing well in unison isn't really ready for part singing.) Singing psalmody as a classroom devotional or musical activity should have great spiritual appeal and catechetical value to students, who can learn untold riches from it. While many households say the office daily, others might find great reward in singing the psalter together. The psalter itself is a prayer book and singing, rather than merely 'reading' its contents is a source of great spiritual joy not to be dismissed easily. I quite often sing from the psalter in a wide variety of situations. Psalmody has almost endless uses and pleasures outside the divine office and other rites wherein there are appointed antiphons.
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • rarty
    Posts: 96
    Oh, I was only replying to the complaint about how far ahead the Anglicans seem to be in books of properly pointed English psalms. I only meant to contend that their Morning and Evening prayer-book services (which proceed numerically through the all the psalms over the course of a month) were made for just such a book, while the current English office (Liturgy of the Hours) was not.

    A notated and pointed English psalm book could certainly be useful and beneficial for Catholics (at least, I'd like one), but in somewhat the same way a Roman Antiphonal would be useful at an Anglican church - i.e., there are many good uses, but you wouldn't rush out to make your own version.

    Speaking of "Ordinariate Compline" though, I had never seen it before, and I like how the psalmody matches the traditional Roman psalms and is invariable (even if there is no antiphon...). Are there settings of the antiphon for the Nunc Dimittis ("Guide us waking") in the St Dunstan's Plainsong Psalter?
  • My apologies for being defensive. Please forgive.
    There are no settings of any antiphons in St Dunstan's Plainsong Psalter. It is strictly a psalter, except that it does have Magnificat and Nunc Dimittis psalm tone settings, as well as a few other canticles, in all the eight modes, plus the four Marian votive antiphons and their collects in English to the historic Gregorian melodies.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,451
    plus the four Marian votive antiphons and their collects in English to the historic Gregorian melodies.


    Simple or Solemn?
  • Um, I think simple, not solemn.
  • Thanks, everyone. I'll get a copy of the St Dunstan Plainchant Psalter and take it from there. I just thought it would be a good idea to ask on the off-chance that somebody had already compiled everything in one place!
  • Folks, I just found this little gem. Can anyone tell me what the numbers above parts of the psalm texts mean?
    https://archive.org/details/TheOrderOfComplineThroughoutTheYear
  • The book you have referenced with your link is not St Dunstan's Plainchant Psalter, but the order for Compline according to the Sarum Use. The numbers above the text are a code indicating that that syllable receives the first cadential note in the respective psalm tone. Thusly, if you have a syllable with a 4 above it, that syllable receives the first cadential note in tone four. Multiple numbers refer to multiple tones. This system had some currency a century ago, but is not, to my knowledge, one that is still used.
  • MJO - Thank you so much!

    You've saved me a lot of stress and strain!
    Thanked by 1M. Jackson Osborn