Pope Francis: Sing Praises to the Lord
  • Fr. Jim Chepponis
    Posts: 220
    Some interesting thoughts from our Holy Father:
    http://www.asianews.it/news-en/Pope:-We’re-able-to-shout-when-our-team-scores-a-goal,-but-not-able-to-sing-praises-to-the-Lord-30155.html
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    As I have noted in other places, I have my days when I am sure the cardinals elected Joe Biden as pope. I understand what Pope Francis is getting at, but he is from a non-English culture with a different understanding and application of praise. I think his version is fine for his culture.
    Thanked by 1benedictgal
  • matthewjmatthewj
    Posts: 2,694
    If one watches the way Pope Francis celebrates Mass, one will find someone who is very formal, serious, and reverent. Some of the dancing and singing and shouting he's talking about he demonstrates through serious internal participation. I think we have to both hear the words of the Pope and see his actions.
    Thanked by 1Andrew Motyka
  • donr
    Posts: 971
    I believe the Pope is correct in his speech. The problem will be in the interpretation. I do not believe he is saying that we need to dance in the church during the Mass. I believe he is saying that our worship can sometimes be emotionless, just going through the motions. We need to praise the Lord with our whole hearts, minds and souls not only during the Mass but every minute of every day. We should be shouting our love of the Lord from the roof tops.
    As far as Sacred Music goes it is my opinion that it does what Pope Francis saying. Beauty is showing Love, praise and joy, even in a more somber piece.
    Thanked by 1kenstb
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    I, too, have noticed the reverence of his masses. No complaints there! Some of his statements, however, are poorly thought out and not clearly delivered.
    Thanked by 3Ben M. Jackson Osborn benedictgal
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    Agreement there, Charles.
  • kenstb
    Posts: 369
    I agree that the pope is correct. I think that the joy of praise the Holy Father is referring to is interior. I took his words as expressing what we should be experiencing during the Gloria and Sanctus, and perhaps a more profound perspective on what those angelic prayers express than the words appear to on the surface.

    As for liturgical dance, I would point any confused people to the words of Francis Cardinal Arinze on that subject.
  • M. Jackson Osborn
    Posts: 8,368
    ...
  • kenstb
    Posts: 369
    Cardinal Arinze's comments are on Youtube.
  • JulieCollJulieColl
    Posts: 2,465
    Much to ponder here:

    ""I wonder sometimes how many times we despise good people in our hearts, good people who praise the Lord as it comes to them, so spontaneously, because they are not cultured, because they do not follow the formalities? I mean really despise them? The Bible says that, because of this, Michal remained sterile for the rest of her life. What does the Word of God mean, here? It means that joy, that the prayer of praise makes us fruitful! Sarah danced in the great moment of her fecundity - at the age of ninety! The fruitfulness that praise of the Lord gives us, the gratuity of praising the Lord: that man or that woman who praises the Lord, who prays praising the Lord, who, when praying the Gloria is filled with joy at doing so, and who, when singing the Sanctus in the Mass rejoices in singing it, is a fruitful person".

    Instead, "those, who are closed in the formality of a prayer that is cold, stingy, might end up as Michal, in the sterility of her formality."


    I wholeheartedly agree that a substantial injection of joy would not be remiss in some of the liturgies I've attended (esp. in the EF, I'm afraid) but, of course, how the Pope's uplifting and inspiring comments will boil down to is that people will think he's encouraging everyone to disregard "the formalities" and wants us all to be dancing with wild abandon at Mass.

    I would respectfully submit that there's no evidence to suggest that he wants us to throw out all the rule books. Instead it would seem he's asking people to recognize the good intentions and sincerity of those whose liturgies do not follow the rubrics instead of looking down at them with contempt. Also, I think he means "dancing" in the metaphorical sense. (At least that's what I hope he means.)
  • JulieCollJulieColl
    Posts: 2,465
    Adding a few more thoughts from the perspective of an EF Catholic:

    I sometimes wonder if some OF celebrations do not suffer from an excess of contrived joy---when there is a smiling singing song leader in your face during the whole liturgy. Although the purpose of the song leader is ostensibly to exhort people to sing and participate, I feel the opposite urge to sit back and let the song leader perform since the whole thing often smacks of a Broadway show and my participation is not needed at all since the over-amplified song leader clearly has things well in hand.

    Many EF celebrations suffer from the opposite phenomenon where a person in the pew is afraid to utter a peep since his/her voice is obviously not welcome during a polyphonic ordinary or even during the responses when silence reigns supreme as it often does at EF masses.

    IMHO, joy is created when the people have a clearly defined role to fulfill and feel needed and welcome. In life, I find that Joy flows from the knowledge that I've successfully completed my duties and mission, and maybe it's the same in the liturgy.

    So, hypothetically, if you have a liturgy where every voice of the congregation can be heard and is encouraged to be heard, then the people will feel their participation is needed and welcome.

    Pope John Paul II famously said that "lack of participation equals alienation" and perhaps that's where Pope Francis' message can be applied. If everyone knows and is able to fulfill his/her proper part in the liturgy they will feel joy and fulfillment since they are a
    necessary part in the public worship and praise of the Lord which is the Mass.
    Thanked by 2rich_enough ryand
  • MaryAnn Carr WilsonMaryAnn Carr Wilson
    Posts: 1,738
    I think Pope Francis is talking about the sacred liturgy as well as private devotions. The discussion of envy and contempt, joy and gratitude, is not limited to public prayers of the Church. Sarah was not dancing at temple, or any public service, for example. Otoh, the HF references the Sanctus, which is sung at Mass, though of course can also be prayed privately.

    Participation question~
    My heart soars with joy during a choral Sanctus. Whether I am singing out loud or not I delight in the text and how it is spun into an aural tapestry. Sounds cheesy, but its true. I take great joy in the choral Sanctus- I'd go so far to say that my spirit dances as I enter into the angels' praise of God's majesty.
    Am I Sarah or Michal?
    Thanked by 2kenstb SamuelDorlaque
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    In my ideal liturgical world in which to work, I would wish for a "high" liturgy with great choral works from significant composers, and a "low" type liturgy where the people could sing simpler Ordinaries. In practice, it seems to work out to an everything or nothing scenario.
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,150
    Am I Sarah or Michal?
    You are assuredly neither. But you are you, and your mind, heart, and spirit are good.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,451
    Chronically miserable people can be miserable in any form of the Rite.
    Unfailingly joyful people can be joyful in any form of the Rite.

    Most of the rest of us - joyful wretches and miserable saints - have spiritual moods which are subject to all sorts of outward conditions, flying aloft on wings of prayer one moment and tumbling to the ground at the slightest cross-breeze the next.

    In our own prayer lives and spiritual formation, we should seek to become stronger, more joyful, more sure - so that the turbulences of life and liturgy can not blow us off course.

    In our public liturgical work for this Hospital of Sinners, we should seek to first protect people's spiritual fragility (do no harm) and then strengthen them to become ever more joyful and steadfast.

    The momentary personal joy related to the specifics of liturgical practice - whether a beautiful chant or a boisterous praise song - is fine and good, and even (sometimes) deeply needed. But if it is not helping to strengthen the soul, if it acts only as a pain reliever and not as a cure, it will become a source of addiction and abuse.
    Thanked by 6melofluent Salieri Andrew Motyka kenstb Heath expeditus1
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,943
    I've gotta dig out my clave, tambourine, bodhráns, triangles, finger cymbals and bell sets from their dusty place underneath my basement stairs.
  • benedictgal
    Posts: 798
    The problem is that he seems to speak to an "imaginary audience". Just who is he directing these comments towards? While there is an element of joy in the Mass, it comes with a proper perspective. I do have a hard time reconciling his words because I remember how he dismissed a group who sent him a spiritual bouquet, calling them "rosary counters". It is a hard one. I respect him, but, he does lack the nuance and the sense of propriety that Benedict had as Pope.
    Thanked by 4Jani CharlesW CHGiffen Salieri
  • Chris HebardChris Hebard
    Posts: 124
    When I first read about this, my take was much more benign. I thought the Pope was reproaching those who don't pick up their hymnals. Like Michal, these mute swans might be looking askance at their singing neighbors, thinking "Who do they think they are? They should stick to the shower. Why are they encouraging the organist? He'll just play another verse." Like all good preachers, the Pope might be including himself in the ranks of sinners, all those clergy who claim with convenient humility that they can't sing.
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    One wonders what Pope Michael is up to these days... (purple)
    Thanked by 1CharlesW
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